The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs

On Mar 2, 11:10 pm, "Bob Loblaw" <B... DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote:
> http://www.destructoid.com/ten-golden-rules-of-japanese-rpgs-73057.phtml

Damn I hate you! you just ruined it for me with this article. Do you
realize that article is a universal spoiler for all JRPGs? You should
have included 'WARNING: SPOILERS FOR EVERY JRPG MADE, IN THE MAKING,
OR TO BE MADE INSIDE'
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

In article <4fabc46b-bc92-468d-b2cf-882f2319efec.TakeThisOut@s12g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
Wolfing <wolfing1.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Mar 2, 11:10 pm, "Bob Loblaw" <B....TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote:
>> http://www.destructoid.com/ten-golden-rules-of-japanese-rpgs-73057.phtml
>
>Damn I hate you! you just ruined it for me with this article. Do you
>realize that article is a universal spoiler for all JRPGs? You should
>have included 'WARNING: SPOILERS FOR EVERY JRPG MADE, IN THE MAKING,
>OR TO BE MADE INSIDE'

No, that goes with this list: http://www.project-apollo.net/text/rpg.html

-KKC, getting through his day with the help of the Gap Band.
--
-- "Arabs are the new Asians, at least in media. Stereotypes gave way to
deeper roles over 40 years of assimilation into western culture. Bruce Lee
kicks ass, Jackie Chan gets laughs, B.D. Wong is a top. Arabs have | kendrick
had Klinger and Monk. Clearly, they have some catching up to do." | @io.com
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

On Mar 3, 10:13 am, Kendrick Kerwin Chua <kendr....TakeThisOut@nospam.io> wrote:
> In article <4fabc46b-bc92-468d-b2cf-882f2319e....TakeThisOut@s12g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
>
> Wolfing <wolfi....TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote:
> >On Mar 2, 11:10 pm, "Bob Loblaw" <B....TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>http://www.destructoid.com/ten-golden-rules-of-japanese-rpgs-73057.phtml
>
> >Damn I hate you! you just ruined it for me with this article. Do you
> >realize that article is a universal spoiler for all JRPGs? You should
> >have included 'WARNING: SPOILERS FOR EVERY JRPG MADE, IN THE MAKING,
> >OR TO BE MADE INSIDE'
>
> No, that goes with this list:http://www.project-apollo.net/text/rpg.html
>
Ah but that page has 192 entries... I can't imagine 192 different
things so even if I try to come with a completely original game, I'll
probably hit 50 or more of those rules without trying
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

Kendrick Kerwin Chua <kendrick RemoveThis @nospam.io> wrote:
>No, that goes with this list: http://www.project-apollo.net/text/rpg.html

I think the Ten Golden Rules list a bit more on the money than this
Grand List. The Grand List of rules orignally only described Chrono
Trigger particularly well, and now with 192 entries a lot of the
cliches are either outdated or only ever apply to small number of games.
For example the "Sleepyhead Rule" seems to be dead, and have I no idea
what "The Ominous Ring of Land" is supposed to refer to. On the other
hand, the Grand List is a more entertaining read.

btw. I'm waiting the JRPG has a scene like this:

Hero: Hey guys the Ultimate Widget we need to save the world
is just over there.
Tough Guy: Yah, all we need to cross this field to get it.
Demure Mage: Oh, no...
Tough Guy: What?!?
Demure Mage: Look there!
Hero: Damn! A "Keep of the Grass" sign.
Demure Mage: What are we going to do?
Hero: I guess we'll have to take the long route through
Forest of Doom, the Desert of Big Nasty Monsters,
the City of Cuddly and Cute Hamsters and hope we
can find a pass through the Spikey Hair Mountains.
Tough Guy: And we were so close! Damn, you Evil Villain!!!

[Scene switches to the Evil Villain sneaking away carring a hammer
and a bucket of paint.]

Evil Villain: Muwahhhahaha!!!

Ross Ridge

--
l/ // Ross Ridge -- The Great HTMU
[oo][oo] rridge RemoveThis @csclub.uwaterloo.ca
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 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

In article <fqi0sj$jng$1@rumours.uwaterloo.ca>,
Ross Ridge <rridge.DeleteThis@caffeine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca> wrote:
>Kendrick Kerwin Chua <kendrick.DeleteThis@nospam.io> wrote:
>>No, that goes with this list: http://www.project-apollo.net/text/rpg.html
>
>I think the Ten Golden Rules list a bit more on the money than this
>Grand List. The Grand List of rules orignally only described Chrono
>Trigger particularly well, and now with 192 entries a lot of the
>cliches are either outdated or only ever apply to small number of games.
>For example the "Sleepyhead Rule" seems to be dead, and have I no idea

I've seen the Sleepyhead Rule as recently as Swordcraft Story, although it
violates the parental gender rule by making both the young man and the
young woman cared for by a single mother.

>what "The Ominous Ring of Land" is supposed to refer to. On the other
>hand, the Grand List is a more entertaining read.

I believe the Ominous Ring was originally seen in Lunar: Eternal Blue,
although people seem to remember the ones in Actraiser and Wild Arms. I
think it's actually inspired by one of the Might and Magic games. If you
want to get technical, the gateway to the Shivering Isles in Oblivion is
an Ominous Ring of Land.

At one point I was inspired to create some sort of geek code to easily
indicate which cliches applied to a particular game. Some people have
already compiled lists for specific titles:

http://www.1up.com/do/my1Up?publicUserId=5474193&pager.offset=24

>btw. I'm waiting the JRPG has a scene like this:
<snip>
> Hero: Damn! A "Keep off the Grass" sign.

I've actually seen this before, where the stalwart hero refuses to break a
law or violate his code of ethics even though it puts him at a tactical
disadvantage. Can't remember what game though.

-KKC, playing Pac Man.
--
-- "Arabs are the new Asians, at least in media. Stereotypes gave way to
deeper roles over 40 years of assimilation into western culture. Bruce Lee
kicks ass, Jackie Chan gets laughs, B.D. Wong is a top. Arabs have | kendrick
had Klinger and Monk. Clearly, they have some catching up to do." | @io.com
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

Ross Ridge <rridge DeleteThis @caffeine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca> wrote:
>btw. I'm waiting the JRPG has a scene like this:
....
> Hero: Damn! A "Keep off the Grass" sign.

Kendrick Kerwin Chua <kendrick DeleteThis @nospam.io> wrote:
>I've actually seen this before, where the stalwart hero refuses to break a
>law or violate his code of ethics even though it puts him at a tactical
>disadvantage. Can't remember what game though.

Well, I'm basically describing an extream case of the "invisible wall"
problem that plagues many games, and is called the "Selective Paralysis"
rule in the Grand List. Japanese games tend have this problem more that
most, apparently having characters that refuse to hop over a low fence
is considered very resonable to rules-bound Japanese gamers. In western
RPGs they'd have to make the fence a bit more of a physical barrier.

Ross Ridge

--
l/ // Ross Ridge -- The Great HTMU
[oo][oo] rridge DeleteThis @csclub.uwaterloo.ca
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db //
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

Nostromo <nospam RemoveThis @forme.org> wrote:
>Hey, can I plug a PS2 into a LCD PC monitor (dsub or dvi) by any chance?
>Anyone know of a converter if not?

Greg Johnson <greg.gsj RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote:
>If your monitor accepts component AV input, then you can use this
>cable: http://www.us.playstation.com/PS2/Accessories/SCPH-10100U
>Otherwise, you'd probably need to find a third-party product, because
>that's as digital as the official connectors get.

There was an official Sony VGA cable that came with Linux kit.
The problem with any PlayStation 2 VGA cable is that it will probably
cost as much a used PS2 and won't with work most games. The PS2 only
supports VGA output for progressive scan game.

Another way to go to get a VGA converter box, that converts one of the
PS2's TV outputs into a VGA output. Adding a TV tuner or capture card
to your PC will do much the same thing. While these solutions will work
with all games, they still are going cost as much a a used PS2.

On the other hand, looking the prices for a used PS2 available locally
on Craigslist... In many cases it would be cheaper to buy a new PS2.

Ross Ridge

--
l/ // Ross Ridge -- The Great HTMU
[oo][oo] rridge RemoveThis @csclub.uwaterloo.ca
-()-/()/ http://www.csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~rridge/
db //
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

Knight37 <knight37m.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote:
>1. Final Fantasy X for PS2.

My big problem with this game is that it's very linear, the most linear
of any of the Final Fantasy games I've played. You start the game at the
bottom of the map and work your way up to the top of the map following
a single path, with a couple of small branches and some back tracking.
The other FF games start out like this pulling you around by the
nose, but you're given more and more freedom as the game progresses.
Eventually you're given an airship that you can fly around and explore
every corner of the world. When you get the airship in FFX all you can
do is go anywhere on that linear path you just trod, plus a couple hidden
points on the map.

The characters good though, the main character is likeable, and the story
isn't half bad. Combat is too easy, making the interesting character
improvement and customization system unimportant, but that describes
pretty much every JRPG.

>2. Final Fantasy VII for PS1. This could be #1 if it had the graphics
>and sound that FFX had.

The graphics in FFVII were pretty bad even by PSX standards. I think
it had as good or better sound than FFX though.

> A really kick ass plot, really cool characters, a great battle system
>(imporoved in FFX but for its day this was one of my favorites). A good
>mix of scifi high-tech stuff and fantasy elements in a way that fits
>the game world perfectly.

Gak. The plot was a mess, the main character is completely unlikable,
neither are most of the rest playable characters. The cool materia
system is made irrelevent by easy combat were all you have to do to win is
repeatly press the attack button. The mismash of technology and magic,
swords and guns doesn't bear close examantion. FFVII is the game both
the Golden Rules and the Grand List were criticising the most when they
talked about the nonsense that can happen when you merge these concepts.

>3. Chrono Trigger for SNES - This is an amazing old school JRPG. You
>can play this on a PC using an emulator.

Great game. Going back and forth in time is cool and handled well.
The sequel, Chrono Cross for the PSX, is in many ways even better.

>7. Blue Dragon for Xbox 360

Never played it and never will. I have no problem with anime-style
graphics in general, but I despise Akira Toriyama's Dragon Ball art style.
(While he did design the characters for Chrono Trigger, the in-game
graphics don't reflect his art style.)

>9. Star Ocean 3 for PS2 - Scifi meets fantasy plot, very decent
>graphics, cool combat engine with a lot of depth.

Great game. Maybe the best PS2 RPG I've played. Mixes technology
and fantasy in much more believable fashion. No random encounters.
You can see monsters and avoid them in most cases, though you will need
to fight a lot of them to level up.

>10. Wild ARMs Alter Code F

I haven't played this game, but I have played Wild ARMs 3. It's a good
game, and I like the dungeon puzzles that are missing from most RPGs
these days.

Ross Ridge

--
l/ // Ross Ridge -- The Great HTMU
[oo][oo] rridge.TakeThisOut@csclub.uwaterloo.ca
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 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

Thus spake Wolfing <wolfing1 DeleteThis @gmail.com>, Mon, 3 Mar 2008 20:50:07 -0800
(PST), Anno Domini:

>It's not that bad. With the PS3 out and doing finally well, you should
>find a used PS2 in Craigslist for pennies, and you can find lots and
>lots of used PS2 RPGs in places like EBWorld or a EB store for like
>$5. So probably for the price of your next PC game you can get a PS2
>and 3 JRPGs, just so you see them and laugh at their silliness heh.
>It took me a little bit to get used to the graphics, but there was a
>big plus point which was that playing on the comfort of my bed was
>much better than the freaking computer chair

You lazy bastage! ;-p Only way I'm gettin the lcd tv for extended periods
from the Mrs is via a divorce!

Hey, can I plug a PS2 into a LCD PC monitor (dsub or dvi) by any chance?
Anyone know of a converter if not?

--
Nostromo
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

On Tue, 04 Mar 2008 16:31:22 +1100, Nostromo <nospam.DeleteThis@forme.org> wrote:

>Hey, can I plug a PS2 into a LCD PC monitor (dsub or dvi) by any chance?
>Anyone know of a converter if not?

If your monitor accepts component AV input, then you can use this
cable: http://www.us.playstation.com/PS2/Accessories/SCPH-10100U
Otherwise, you'd probably need to find a third-party product, because
that's as digital as the official connectors get.
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

On Tue, 4 Mar 2008 05:48:09 -0800 (PST), Knight37 <knight37m DeleteThis @gmail.com>
wrote:
>3. Chrono Trigger for SNES - This is an amazing old school JRPG. You
>can play this on a PC using an emulator. It has a really awesome time
>travel plot, fun, lovable characters like Lucca the tom-girl mechanic
>and Frog, the.. frog. The combat system is unique in that depending on
>which characters you choose to bring into your 3-man party out of your
>pool of characters, you get different team-combos made available to
>use. For example, Chrono and Frog could be able to do some special
>combat maneuver together than only they can do together. Even the
>random encounters aren't so bad in this one because you can see them
>on the screen and sometimes just run around them to avoid battles if
>you don't need the experience. Awesome soundtrack also, I even bought
>the CD's for it.

Chrono Trigger was really good. I like all the time travel, too, and for
SNES even the cartoon-ish graphics were pretty decent.


--
chuk
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

On Tue, 4 Mar 2008 06:27:10 -0800 (PST), Wolfing <wolfing1.RemoveThis@gmail.com>
wrote:

>I didn't like FF-X *that* much. It was good and I liked it, but not in
>my top 10 list by any chance. I liked Suikoden III much more even
>though technologically speaking is not as advanced, but the three
>parallel storylines and all the characters, that was way too cool.
>One of the few games that I was trying not to play too much because I
>didn't want it to end

And it never came out for PAL machines, so I never had a chance to
play it, and Nostromo couldn't either unless he bought a modded or
imported unit.
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs 

Ross Ridge <rridge DeleteThis @caffeine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca> wrote:
>Adding a TV tuner or capture card to your PC will do much the same thing.
>While these solutions will work with all games, they still are going
>cost as much a a used PS2.

Paul Murray <paul DeleteThis @murray.net> wrote:
>However with the capture card solution you may find this introduces a
>second or so of lag, which will make anything with a real-time element
>very hard to play.

Oh, yah, I forgot about this. I had an ATI All-in-Wonder 9800 that
had no lag under Windows 98, but there was a huge lag when I upgraded
to Windows XP. This came from two sources. One was a second or two or
lag caused by the TiVo-like pause and rewind live TV feature in the TV
player. This feature could be turned off, so it wasn't much of a problem.
The second source of lag was caused by the driver as it delayed the video
a fraction of a section to synchronize it with the delay caused by using
digital path for the audio instead of an analogue path. This couldn't
be disabled and even a fraction of second delay can fustrate real-time
game play.

Ross Ridge

--
l/ // Ross Ridge -- The Great HTMU
[oo][oo] rridge DeleteThis @csclub.uwaterloo.ca
-()-/()/ http://www.csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~rridge/
db //
 >> Stay informed about: The ten golden rules of japanese RPGs