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Next: NEED HELP WITH LOST IN BLUE DS
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External
Since: Jan 07, 2005
Posts: 1163
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 3:55 am
Post subject: "I do not think your role is what you think is"
Archived from groups: alt>games>warcraft (more info?)
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Just had a most enjoyable Underbog run.
Warrior(63), Paladin(63), Druid(64), Hunter (66), Priest (66).
(Not entirely sure of the levels except for the hunter and priest)
At first we went for the traditional roles. *shrug* We were doing
okay that way until the first boss. Then the hunter forgot to move
out of the poison and went down relatively early. Ended up wiping,
though we had almost taken out the boss.
On our next attempt the druid took up tanking (I think they had more
armor in bear form than the warrior did), and I suggested I go shadow
form and leave the Pally to main heal. The boss went down fairly
easily this time, despite somehow managing to heal about 1/3 of his
life just when we'd almost taken him out. Dunno if he usually does
that or not.
I dropped from shadow twice in the rest of the instance for some more
focused healing, once when the Pally had run out of mana and the other
time when we had a precipitous pull, and I think we ended up with a
few more mobs than we wanted. Mobs where everywhere, not just on 1 or
2 people, so I dropped from shadow to put a few renews and what not on
people so the pally would actually have time to get around to casting
heals on everyone.
No deaths until the last fight with the Black Stalker thingy where our
Warrior and Druid bit the dust. Or was it the warrior and the Pally?
Not sure. One thing I noticed was the Pally seemed to have full mana,
but life bars were going down and never up, so maybe he had lagged out
a bit. Or maybe it was me lagging, as in the next second the Pally
had no mana. Anyway, the hunter and me had enough dps left in us to
finish the boss off and I quickly dropped shadow to res the two that
fell. The warrior made good that run, going uncontested for some
plate chest armor from the boss with the tamed druid, and winning some
shoulder plate from the last boss over the Pally. Apart from grey's I
won the roll for a chest and got a blue amulet. +healing, +int and
+9mp5. Bit funny finding that as a guildie had just whispered maybe
an hour earlier that they'd had it drop from a mob and was I
interested in it.
Back to the subject though, having the druid tank and the warrior
dps/off tank, the pally heal and the priest dps/back up heal seemed to
work really well. Probably better than the warrior tanking and priest
main healing. For one thing, being able to go all out dps'ing as a
shadow priest means everyone's getting mana from the vampiric touch.
During the final fight I did about 20,000 damage. So there's 1000
mana for everyone. And with vapiric embrace, the main healer doesn't
have to worry so much about anyone but the main tank, so they save
mana by not having those extra heals to do. Holy priests may be out
of a job, but that just means they can respec shadow and not only let
someone else spend all run looking at life bars but can also solo
quicker too!! ; ) |
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External
Since: Dec 30, 2004
Posts: 1233
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 6:49 am
Post subject: Re: "I do not think your role is what you think is" [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Mar 1, 2:17 am, deathsab... DeleteThis @yahoo.com.au (Ashen Shugar) wrote:
> Just had a most enjoyable Underbog run.
>
> Warrior(63), Paladin(63), Druid(64), Hunter (66), Priest (66).
> (Not entirely sure of the levels except for the hunter and priest)
>
> At first we went for the traditional roles. *shrug* We were doing
> okay that way until the first boss. Then the hunter forgot to move
> out of the poison and went down relatively early. Ended up wiping,
> though we had almost taken out the boss.
>
> On our next attempt the druid took up tanking (I think they had more
> armor in bear form than the warrior did), and I suggested I go shadow
> form and leave the Pally to main heal. The boss went down fairly
> easily this time, despite somehow managing to heal about 1/3 of his
> life just when we'd almost taken him out. Dunno if he usually does
> that or not.
>
> I dropped from shadow twice in the rest of the instance for some more
> focused healing, once when the Pally had run out of mana and the other
> time when we had a precipitous pull, and I think we ended up with a
> few more mobs than we wanted. Mobs where everywhere, not just on 1 or
> 2 people, so I dropped from shadow to put a few renews and what not on
> people so the pally would actually have time to get around to casting
> heals on everyone.
>
> No deaths until the last fight with the Black Stalker thingy where our
> Warrior and Druid bit the dust. Or was it the warrior and the Pally?
> Not sure. One thing I noticed was the Pally seemed to have full mana,
> but life bars were going down and never up, so maybe he had lagged out
> a bit. Or maybe it was me lagging, as in the next second the Pally
> had no mana. Anyway, the hunter and me had enough dps left in us to
> finish the boss off and I quickly dropped shadow to res the two that
> fell. The warrior made good that run, going uncontested for some
> plate chest armor from the boss with the tamed druid, and winning some
> shoulder plate from the last boss over the Pally. Apart from grey's I
> won the roll for a chest and got a blue amulet. +healing, +int and
> +9mp5. Bit funny finding that as a guildie had just whispered maybe
> an hour earlier that they'd had it drop from a mob and was I
> interested in it.
>
> Back to the subject though, having the druid tank and the warrior
> dps/off tank, the pally heal and the priest dps/back up heal seemed to
> work really well. Probably better than the warrior tanking and priest
> main healing. For one thing, being able to go all out dps'ing as a
> shadow priest means everyone's getting mana from the vampiric touch.
> During the final fight I did about 20,000 damage. So there's 1000
> mana for everyone. And with vapiric embrace, the main healer doesn't
> have to worry so much about anyone but the main tank, so they save
> mana by not having those extra heals to do. Holy priests may be out
> of a job, but that just means they can respec shadow and not only let
> someone else spend all run looking at life bars but can also solo
> quicker too!! ; )
Damn thats a nice shadow build. I look forward to sending my priest
into one of those places with the herder some day. She is semi shadow
right now, up through VE just enough to solo or duo with the Mrs the
rest of her way to end game at which point knowing that we have some
good shadow builds in the gang I'll feel quite comfy about a nice holy
build. Have you teamed with Zen as I think he had specced to full
Holy. If so I'm wondering how it worked when you two tumbled together.
Tally ho mate!
Orion |
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External
Since: Dec 27, 2006
Posts: 41
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 9:10 am
Post subject: Re: "I do not think your role is what you think is" [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Ashen Shugar" <deathsabyss.RemoveThis@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:45e677a0.33666093@News.Individual.NET...
>
> Just had a most enjoyable Underbog run.
>
> Warrior(63), Paladin(63), Druid(64), Hunter (66), Priest (66).
> (Not entirely sure of the levels except for the hunter and priest)
>
Our core group from 60-70 has been a druid tanking, warrior dpsing, shadow
priest, me holy paly, and then some guildie be it whatever. the priest and
warrior change depending on the day but the druid who main tanks and me are
the constent.
Your correct with a shadow priest in the party a good paly will never run
out of mana and never stop healing. At 70 I am sitting at 1090 healing gear
now and about 9500 mana. my mana usage varies between the 3 priests that
are normally in the group, two of them it is almost a shock if at the end
of any pull save a boss fight that anybody is below 95 percent health and me
being below 90 percent mana. Not only does your VE return health to the
party, but palys also have a new ability that gives them 8 percent then 10
percent of there heals received also in mana. Its just insane when a shadow
priest just unlloads on a target and you see yourself ticking for 180 mana
back a sec while casting. thats not per 5 sec thats every sec.
If people play around with there roles they will learn that classes are not
so "rail roaded" to do just one thing. play around and learn to have fun.
there are very few runs were you have to have certain things.
You should also think about using your MC abilites.... MC a healer and have
them heal the party... there heals are normally insane, and when there
ready to be taken down you have them oom... GRIN
> At first we went for the traditional roles. *shrug* We were doing
> okay that way until the first boss. Then the hunter forgot to move
> out of the poison and went down relatively early. Ended up wiping,
> though we had almost taken out the boss.
>
> On our next attempt the druid took up tanking (I think they had more
> armor in bear form than the warrior did), and I suggested I go shadow
> form and leave the Pally to main heal. The boss went down fairly
> easily this time, despite somehow managing to heal about 1/3 of his
> life just when we'd almost taken him out. Dunno if he usually does
> that or not.
>
> I dropped from shadow twice in the rest of the instance for some more
> focused healing, once when the Pally had run out of mana and the other
> time when we had a precipitous pull, and I think we ended up with a
> few more mobs than we wanted. Mobs where everywhere, not just on 1 or
> 2 people, so I dropped from shadow to put a few renews and what not on
> people so the pally would actually have time to get around to casting
> heals on everyone.
>
> No deaths until the last fight with the Black Stalker thingy where our
> Warrior and Druid bit the dust. Or was it the warrior and the Pally?
> Not sure. One thing I noticed was the Pally seemed to have full mana,
> but life bars were going down and never up, so maybe he had lagged out
> a bit. Or maybe it was me lagging, as in the next second the Pally
> had no mana. Anyway, the hunter and me had enough dps left in us to
> finish the boss off and I quickly dropped shadow to res the two that
> fell. The warrior made good that run, going uncontested for some
> plate chest armor from the boss with the tamed druid, and winning some
> shoulder plate from the last boss over the Pally. Apart from grey's I
> won the roll for a chest and got a blue amulet. +healing, +int and
> +9mp5. Bit funny finding that as a guildie had just whispered maybe
> an hour earlier that they'd had it drop from a mob and was I
> interested in it.
>
> Back to the subject though, having the druid tank and the warrior
> dps/off tank, the pally heal and the priest dps/back up heal seemed to
> work really well. Probably better than the warrior tanking and priest
> main healing. For one thing, being able to go all out dps'ing as a
> shadow priest means everyone's getting mana from the vampiric touch.
> During the final fight I did about 20,000 damage. So there's 1000
> mana for everyone. And with vapiric embrace, the main healer doesn't
> have to worry so much about anyone but the main tank, so they save
> mana by not having those extra heals to do. Holy priests may be out
> of a job, but that just means they can respec shadow and not only let
> someone else spend all run looking at life bars but can also solo
> quicker too!! ; )
> >> Stay informed about: "I do not think your role is what you think is" |
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External
Since: Aug 02, 2005
Posts: 2350
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 10:13 am
Post subject: Re: "I do not think your role is what you think is" [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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External
Since: Jan 07, 2005
Posts: 1163
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:57 pm
Post subject: Re: "I do not think your role is what you think is" [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I think it was "cling" <clingman23 DeleteThis @comcast.com> that wrote something
like...
>You should also think about using your MC abilites.... MC a healer and have
>them heal the party... there heals are normally insane, and when there
>ready to be taken down you have them oom... GRIN
Wasn't really needed in that run, though I did it once in a 4 mob
pull. Only got a warrior type, but I did note that during part of the
fight my MC mob had agro on one of the other mobs. The best use I've
seen for MC is in ZF with the basilisk and 2 troll patrols. MC one of
the patrols, frog the other one with the MC'ed mob then start hitting
on the basilisk to hold agro on it. If you're not main healer and see
the patrol coming in time, you can hold them off forever and a day
while the other 4 in the party finish off whatever fight they're on.
Additionally, in some places where the mobs aren't programmed to work
together, you can just MC a mob and walk it away from the others then
kill it solo. Rinse and repeat. Works in ZF. I know it doesn't in
BRD though. The 2 dwarves right at the start, you can MC one, walk it
anywhere at all and the other dwarf won't bat an eye lid, but once MC
drops, they *both* come after you, no matter where you move the MC'ed
one too.
Speaking of BRD though, MC'ing the medics can be quite useful. As
you say, they've got good heals, though fairly nasty cool downs. But
you can still heal your party, they can't heal the other mobs, and
your party can focus their fire on fewer mobs. Even fewer if you also
use the medics to off tank. ; )
One danger to MC'ing though, is not knowing what their abilities do
exactly and trying them out. Thought I'd try a mobs shadow volley in
Uldaman once. Ended up pulling the mini boss near the chest with the
necklace part and his two friends. Seemed the shadow volley had a
fair range that it looked for targets. ; )
Those sort of fights are the more interesting ones I find. Where you
pull out some of the under used skills and find ways to make them
shine.
Ashen Shugar
--
The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule! >> Stay informed about: "I do not think your role is what you think is" |
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External
Since: Jan 07, 2005
Posts: 1163
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:58 pm
Post subject: Re: "I do not think your role is what you think is" [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I think it was "Orion Ryder" <orionryder.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> that wrote
something like...
>
>> Back to the subject though, having the druid tank and the warrior
>> dps/off tank, the pally heal and the priest dps/back up heal seemed to
>> work really well. Probably better than the warrior tanking and priest
>> main healing. For one thing, being able to go all out dps'ing as a
>> shadow priest means everyone's getting mana from the vampiric touch.
>> During the final fight I did about 20,000 damage. So there's 1000
>> mana for everyone. And with vapiric embrace, the main healer doesn't
>> have to worry so much about anyone but the main tank, so they save
>> mana by not having those extra heals to do. Holy priests may be out
>> of a job, but that just means they can respec shadow and not only let
>> someone else spend all run looking at life bars but can also solo
>> quicker too!! ; )
>
>Damn thats a nice shadow build. I look forward to sending my priest
>into one of those places with the herder some day. She is semi shadow
>right now, up through VE just enough to solo or duo with the Mrs the
>rest of her way to end game at which point knowing that we have some
>good shadow builds in the gang I'll feel quite comfy about a nice holy
>build. Have you teamed with Zen as I think he had specced to full
>Holy. If so I'm wondering how it worked when you two tumbled together.
>
>Tally ho mate!
>
I'm not sure how Zen is specced. I've seen him use the +spirit buff,
and I've seen him become the spirit of redemption.
Anyway, he's main healed and I've gone dps. Though as I recall, I
didn't go shadowform and go all out, instead being more focused on
backup healing. That may have been a mistake. *shrug*. The worry of
course had been agro management. Don't want to be pulling mobs off
the tank. Shadow priests are still squishies, if not quite as squishy
as holy priests or mages. But depending on the make up of the group
of mobs you're fighting and the tanks ability to handle multiple mobs,
it seems to be possible to go fairly hard without fear. I think the
Underbog run was a good example of how useful it was to have a tank
tank and something more like a dps tank. Any mobs that looked like
they were going to go the wrong way could be quickly picked back up by
the dps tank without disrupting the main tanks stride at generating
hate on all the other mobs. Though recalling, the hunter often did a
fairly good job of tanking one of the mobs, though usually it was only
long enough to get them into an ice trap.
I dunno, some groups just seem to work well together. Or perhaps they
suit the environment they're fighting in. And then some groups that
you'd think on paper should work well, just don't seem to. Had a mana
tomb run like that. We were able to get through the mobs okay when
things were settled but when the unexpected happened things just
seemed to fall apart. Made it too the final boss and had a couple of
attempts at him, but it just didn't seem to work. Had a pally there,
probably should have suggested they take over main healing so I could
go shadow. Pally probably could have healed about as well as i could,
if not better what with my latency, and in shadow form I probably
would have had higher dps than them trying to dps. Of course, if I
had run out of mana before the fight ended, my dps would have dropped
off sharply. Didn't have the mana fiend then as possible source to
get mana back while waiting on the potion cool down.
Well, I'd better get to sleep before I work myself up into playing WoW
some more. ; )
Ashen Shugar
--
The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule! >> Stay informed about: "I do not think your role is what you think is" |
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Since: Feb 01, 2006
Posts: 336
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 3:14 pm
Post subject: Re: "I do not think your role is what you think is" [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Ashen Shugar wrote:
> During the final fight I did about 20,000 damage. So there's 1000
> mana for everyone. And with vapiric embrace, the main healer doesn't
> have to worry so much about anyone but the main tank, so they save
> mana by not having those extra heals to do. Holy priests may be out
> of a job, but that just means they can respec shadow and not only let
> someone else spend all run looking at life bars but can also solo
> quicker too!! ; )
exactly what part of my issue is right now. i want to heal, thats why i
created the priest and specced holy. all this 'break the role mold' is
fine...but it should be by choice and it seems like its being forced
more and more.
kim <3
-----------
Kimbelyn / Priestess of The Exiles of Lordaeron / Stormrage
http://www.eolguild.org | http://wow.allakhazam.com/profile.html?216812 >> Stay informed about: "I do not think your role is what you think is" |
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External
Since: Feb 01, 2006
Posts: 336
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 3:16 pm
Post subject: Re: "I do not think your role is what you think is" [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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jes.t.er DeleteThis @hexduxhmp.org wrote:
> My experience has been that a lot of the new encounters really do seem
> to suggest an optimal party being mostly folks breaking the role-mold.
> Unfortunately, most players can't do that.
im all for being open, but i chose a role be cause i like that role. i
shouldnt *have* to change. im all for druid/paly tanks, druid/paly
healers...but personally, i shouldnt have to feel like i need to be
shadow and let someone else heal so that the group can be 'optimal'.
thats just nonsense.
kim <3
-----------
Kimbelyn / Priestess of The Exiles of Lordaeron / Stormrage
http://www.eolguild.org | http://wow.allakhazam.com/profile.html?216812 >> Stay informed about: "I do not think your role is what you think is" |
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