Need more meat.

Patrick Baldwin wrote:
> One of my friends in my gaming group has
> finally decided he's into running a D&D
> game. He's going to be using the module
> _The Speaker in Dreams_. We're down to
> 3 PCs right now, so we're all going to
> be 6th level instead of 5th.
>
> The party will consist of a druid, a ranger,
> and my character, a halfling beguiler.
>
> At the DM's suggestion, I'm going to take
> leadership so we can get More Meat. Anything
> to suggest for a meaty cohort, ideally one
> stupid enough that we can basically treat
> it as an attack dog?

I remember 1st edition, when you could actually buy an attack dog. No real
rules for it, so it could be very useful, if the GM were kind.

Ah, those were the days.

--
Reginald Blue
"I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my
telephone."
- Bjarne Stroustrup (originator of C++) [quoted at the 2003
International Conference on Intelligent User Interfaces]
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"Reginald Blue" <Reginald_Blue.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:fr690b$e0r$1@USTR-NEWS.TR.UNISYS.COM...
> Patrick Baldwin wrote:

>> At the DM's suggestion, I'm going to take
>> leadership so we can get More Meat. Anything
>> to suggest for a meaty cohort, ideally one
>> stupid enough that we can basically treat
>> it as an attack dog?
>
> I remember 1st edition, when you could actually buy an attack dog.

You cannot do that now?

--
^v^v^Malachias Invictus^v^v^

It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishment the scroll,
I am the Master of my fate:
I am the Captain of my soul.

from _Invictus_, by William Ernest Henley
 >> Stay informed about: Need more meat. 

Justisaur wrote:
> But he's taking leadership, so if he wants an attack dog, he could go
> with an awakened one, or better yet a blink dog, like one of our party
> did. He cheezed it up pretty good by giving the blink dog totemist
> levels. The dog grew four arms and outdamaged our warblade... DM put
> the kibosh on that pretty fast though.

Don'tcha just hate it when DM's do that... I mean, come up with such a cool
idea and, bam, just because you're invincible or something... they take it
away.



--
Reginald Blue
"I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my
telephone."
- Bjarne Stroustrup (originator of C++) [quoted at the 2003
International Conference on Intelligent User Interfaces]
 >> Stay informed about: Need more meat. 

"Reginald Blue" <Reginald_Blue.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:fr6mnh$hk9$1@USTR-NEWS.TR.UNISYS.COM...
> Justisaur wrote:
>> But he's taking leadership, so if he wants an attack dog, he could go
>> with an awakened one, or better yet a blink dog, like one of our party
>> did. He cheezed it up pretty good by giving the blink dog totemist
>> levels. The dog grew four arms and outdamaged our warblade... DM put
>> the kibosh on that pretty fast though.
>
> Don'tcha just hate it when DM's do that... I mean, come up with such a
> cool idea and, bam, just because you're invincible or something... they
> take it away.

I certainly think so. I consider such innovative play a sign that my PCs
are ready for me to up the threat level (and, of course, the reward level).

--
^v^v^Malachias Invictus^v^v^

It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishment the scroll,
I am the Master of my fate:
I am the Captain of my soul.

from _Invictus_, by William Ernest Henley
 >> Stay informed about: Need more meat. 

On Mar 11, 2:11 pm, "Malachias Invictus" <invictuse... DeleteThis @yahoo.com>
wrote:
> "Reginald Blue" <Reginald_B... DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fr6mnh$hk9$1@USTR-NEWS.TR.UNISYS.COM...
>
> > Justisaur wrote:
> >> But he's taking leadership, so if he wants an attack dog, he could go
> >> with an awakened one, or better yet a blink dog, like one of our party
> >> did. He cheezed it up pretty good by giving the blink dog totemist
> >> levels. The dog grew four arms and outdamaged our warblade... DM put
> >> the kibosh on that pretty fast though.
>
> > Don'tcha just hate it when DM's do that... I mean, come up with such a
> > cool idea and, bam, just because you're invincible or something... they
> > take it away.

Especially since his character died right after that.

>
> I certainly think so. I consider such innovative play a sign that my PCs
> are ready for me to up the threat level (and, of course, the reward level).
>

Unfortunately this particular player is a munchkin of the first order,
and is known to troll the boards for ways to make his characters
invincible. So for the sake of playing the game instead of just
following him around as he kills everything without help, I'm glad.
He's the same one that's always giving me trouble in my game.

The DM's argument didn't make any sense to me though. He said
"Totemist is stupid! If the dog had been a Fighter that'd be o.k."
Which left me scratching my head...

My argument was it's a freeking blink dog, it advances by HD, but they
didn't buy that one. Sprit vs. letter...

- Justisaur
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In article <fr690b$e0r$1@USTR-NEWS.TR.UNISYS.COM>,
"Reginald Blue" <Reginald_Blue DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:

> Patrick Baldwin wrote:
> > One of my friends in my gaming group has
> > finally decided he's into running a D&D
> > game. He's going to be using the module
> > _The Speaker in Dreams_. We're down to
> > 3 PCs right now, so we're all going to
> > be 6th level instead of 5th.
> >
> > The party will consist of a druid, a ranger,
> > and my character, a halfling beguiler.
> >
> > At the DM's suggestion, I'm going to take
> > leadership so we can get More Meat. Anything
> > to suggest for a meaty cohort, ideally one
> > stupid enough that we can basically treat
> > it as an attack dog?
>
> I remember 1st edition, when you could actually buy an attack dog. No real
> rules for it, so it could be very useful, if the GM were kind.
>
> Ah, those were the days.

Warboar in plate barding.

- Allen
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"Justisaur" <justisaur.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:91e7a188-d970-4cc1-8b57-676a5144f36b@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> On Mar 11, 2:11 pm, "Malachias Invictus" <invictuse....RemoveThis@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> "Reginald Blue" <Reginald_B....RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:fr6mnh$hk9$1@USTR-NEWS.TR.UNISYS.COM...
>>
>> > Justisaur wrote:
>> >> But he's taking leadership, so if he wants an attack dog, he could go
>> >> with an awakened one, or better yet a blink dog, like one of our party
>> >> did. He cheezed it up pretty good by giving the blink dog totemist
>> >> levels. The dog grew four arms and outdamaged our warblade... DM put
>> >> the kibosh on that pretty fast though.
>>
>> > Don'tcha just hate it when DM's do that... I mean, come up with such a
>> > cool idea and, bam, just because you're invincible or something... they
>> > take it away.
>
> Especially since his character died right after that.

Was there a wailing and ghashing of teeth?

>> I certainly think so. I consider such innovative play a sign that my PCs
>> are ready for me to up the threat level (and, of course, the reward
>> level).

> Unfortunately this particular player is a munchkin of the first order,
> and is known to troll the boards for ways to make his characters
> invincible.

Becoming invicible is pretty difficult, if not impossible.

> So for the sake of playing the game instead of just
> following him around as he kills everything without help, I'm glad.

I sometimes find that the best way to deal with power differences is to put
the powerful character in a higher level group.

> He's the same one that's always giving me trouble in my game.

Well, it sounds like your play styles are not compatible. You could always
kick him over to me for some roughing up, since you guys are local

> The DM's argument didn't make any sense to me though. He said
> "Totemist is stupid! If the dog had been a Fighter that'd be o.k."
> Which left me scratching my head...

Yeah. That makes no sense to me either.

> My argument was it's a freeking blink dog, it advances by HD, but they
> didn't buy that one. Sprit vs. letter...

Well, there is no real reason why a blink dog could not have class levels.
Official WotC adventures have had quadrupeds with class levels before, in
fact. I just don't see how the beastie could possibly be tough enough to
compete with PCs of your level, given that he has to remain two levels
behind. I mean, if your party is 12th level, that means the blink dog could
be a 6th level Totemist. If he is doing more damage than a 12th level
Warblade, there is something wrong with that Warblade, or some rule breaking
going on with the blink dog.

--
^v^v^Malachias Invictus^v^v^

It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishment the scroll,
I am the Master of my fate:
I am the Captain of my soul.

from _Invictus_, by William Ernest Henley
 >> Stay informed about: Need more meat. 

"Justisaur" <justisaur.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cfbf0a2e-9126-4e67-bfff-9f38629e8430@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On Mar 11, 2:32 pm, Alcore <alc....DeleteThis@uurth.com> wrote:

>> I believe that Handle Animal can be used untrained.
>
> Unfortunately it's trained only, which doesn't fit right IMHO.

It can be used untrained with domestic animals.
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On Mar 12, 8:12 am, Patrick Baldwin <p... DeleteThis @osmium.mv.net> wrote:
> Justisaur <justis... DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote:
> >On Mar 11, 8:10 am, Patrick Baldwin <p... DeleteThis @osmium.mv.net> wrote:
>
> >You've got divine, arcane, and fighter type covered already - between
> >the druid and the ranger you've almost got 2 fighters. beguiler has
> >some of the rogue stuff covered. Looks like a pretty good 3 person
> >team. If you just want meat you might go with a half-orc or dwarf
> >barbarian or possibly barbarian/cleric which will allow you to cover
> >some of the divine weaknesses of a druid.i
>
> I was thinking maybe dwarf barbarian or maybe straight
> up orc barbarian instead of half orc. The orc is smashier
> and more like an attack dog.

True, but the lower Wis means more susceptible to will targeted spells
and effect. You don't want your doggie attacking you.

>
> >A crusader or knight might
> >be good with your party, as they can keep things from reaching the
> >rest of your party. If you wanted more arcane coverage you could get
> >a conjurer - although the druid can handle summoning just fine.
>
> Trying to minimize the amount of role-playing stuff
> for the cohort; don't like people playing multiple primary
> roles. Crusaders and knights seem too much like, y'know,
> people and stuff.

A knight would be easier, not worrying about the maneuvers that
Crusaders randomly get every round. Knights don't really have to do
much RP. Just "Yes m'Lord!"

It doesn't fit what you said you are after though.

- Justisaur
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On 2008-03-12, Malachias Invictus <invictusebay DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Justisaur" <justisaur DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:91e7a188-d970-4cc1-8b57-676a5144f36b@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>> The DM's argument didn't make any sense to me though. He said
>> "Totemist is stupid! If the dog had been a Fighter that'd be o.k."
>> Which left me scratching my head...
>
> Yeah. That makes no sense to me either.
>
>> My argument was it's a freeking blink dog, it advances by HD, but they
>> didn't buy that one. Sprit vs. letter...
>
> Well, there is no real reason why a blink dog could not have class levels.
> Official WotC adventures have had quadrupeds with class levels before, in
> fact.

There's got to be some limit on that sort of thing though. Personally I
would allow most intelligent nonhumanoids to advance by HD or Core
classes only. Splatbook cheese and Prestige Classes are Right Out.
Limiting it to Core classes means you're slightly less likely to get a
combination of things that were clearly not meant to go together.

Even then you can get Grell with Rogue Levels which is just wrong.

--
--- An' thou dost not get caught, do as thou wilt shall be the law ---
"Religion disperses like a fog, kingdoms perish, but the works of
scholars remain for an eternity." - Ulughbek
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"sw" <sw RemoveThis @eyrie.org> wrote in message
news:slrnftfv39.dfc.sw@haven.eyrie.org...
> On 2008-03-12, Malachias Invictus <invictusebay RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>> "Justisaur" <justisaur RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:91e7a188-d970-4cc1-8b57-676a5144f36b@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>>> The DM's argument didn't make any sense to me though. He said
>>> "Totemist is stupid! If the dog had been a Fighter that'd be o.k."
>>> Which left me scratching my head...
>>
>> Yeah. That makes no sense to me either.
>>
>>> My argument was it's a freeking blink dog, it advances by HD, but they
>>> didn't buy that one. Sprit vs. letter...
>>
>> Well, there is no real reason why a blink dog could not have class
>> levels.
>> Official WotC adventures have had quadrupeds with class levels before, in
>> fact.
>
> There's got to be some limit on that sort of thing though. Personally I
> would allow most intelligent nonhumanoids to advance by HD or Core
> classes only. Splatbook cheese and Prestige Classes are Right Out.

Eh. I don't see any problem with it.

> Limiting it to Core classes means you're slightly less likely to get a
> combination of things that were clearly not meant to go together.

I suppose. Then again, I have not seen any combinations I would have a
problem with.

> Even then you can get Grell with Rogue Levels which is just wrong.

Says you. I think that sounds like a great combination.

--
^v^v^Malachias Invictus^v^v^

It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishment the scroll,
I am the Master of my fate:
I am the Captain of my soul.

from _Invictus_, by William Ernest Henley
 >> Stay informed about: Need more meat. 

Reginald Blue wrote:
> Malachias Invictus wrote:
>> Reginald Blue wrote:

>>> I remember 1st edition, when you could actually buy an attack dog.
>>
>> You cannot do that now?
>
> Sure, but then you need to buy the Handle Animal skill to get it
> trained... right? Or can someone else train it and you can just use the
> commands? Let's see...
>
> Yeah, it seems that teaching them the trick is nearly useless without
> the skill to execute it:

Dude, keep reading, just another few lines and you're at the tricks,
some of which you'll note work just fine without any checks, the animal
performing by default.
Like to defend you, or to attack unfamiliar agressors. And only DC 10
as a move action for the other stuff.

> In 1st ed, you'd buy a guard dog and, lo and behold, you had a guard dog
> who would... you know... guard you and stuff.
>
> Now... you have to like be skilled in guard dog or something.

Or, just assume the game works fairly sensibly, because it often does
when you actually RTFM.

--
tussock

I'm like a box of chocolates; you never know what you're gunna get.
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