colorclash refund

"Mayhem" <mayhemers.TakeThisOut@hotmail-dot-com.no-spam.invalid> schreef in bericht
news:jK%jg.38140$jP6.32250@fe35.usenetserver.com...
> Probably by virtue of the fact you haven't bought Color Clash, haven't
> paid any money for it, haven't had the box destroyed and felt
> disappointed. Means you have trouble seeing our point of view on this
> matter.
>
>
You can not have an opinion on this when you did not buy the homebrew? a
topic starter on Usenet is asking for opinions/answers maybe discussion,
well the only thing I did was giving my opinion on this matter, contributing
to the discussion.

Next to the many positive experiences I had also bad experiences in the past
when buying stuff via the internet in other parts of the world, sometimes
this had to do with shipping or bad packaging. On the other hand I collect
Vextrex items and homebrews...
On the base of these experiences I built the arguments for my opinion on
this topic.

What is the big deal with my opinion? Get a life and see it as a one man's
opinion... you are sounding like a little kid on the schoolyard getting
kicked...
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

"Marc Goldman" <marc RemoveThis @countinghouse.co.uk> schreef in bericht
news:RW%jg.11956$s4.11318@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
>
> "Mayhem" <mayhemers RemoveThis @hotmail-dot-com.no-spam.invalid> wrote in message
> news:jK%jg.38140$jP6.32250@fe35.usenetserver.com...
> > Probably by virtue of the fact you haven't bought Color Clash, haven't
> > paid any money for it, haven't had the box destroyed and felt
> > disappointed. Means you have trouble seeing our point of view on this
> > matter.
>
> And also suggests Lodewijk isn't the staunch supporter of homebrew he
> sounded like with his original comments.

Thank you for analysing my comments... I'am not a hardcore homebrew
collector, but I bought several titles over the past years.

> Taking a wait and see approach to buying a product is perfectly acceptable
> and I have no problem with that. But if the more committed homebrew
> supporters didn't buy blind, like a lot of us did, then this project just
> wouldn't have happened. So it rather weakens any arguments coming from
> Lodewijk.

maybe you are right, but that has nothing to do with the trashed box,
martijn didn't forsee this problem. And I think when you are a dedicated
homebrew developer you do not let the project down when the order quantities
are low. Maybe they will use other production methodes to lower the costs,
digital printing, standard cheaper boxes etc, but the homebrew they are
dedicated to will be made...
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

I'm not in it for the money, I was just dissappointed about such a nice box
being damaged, but I appreciate the offer nonetheless , thanks.

I kinda straigthened out the box so I'm okay....

Ah well,
One day these damaged Color Clash boxes will be collector's items as
'one of the first RS games, which was crushed sent in a bubble envelope'

of course this means you have to save the original envelope with it

Pepijn


"Martijn Wenting" <info DeleteThis @vectrexnews.com> wrote in message
news:3i2k825lhavtbavaa1o1jrbjo7dn4qtibq@4ax.com...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Just returned from holiday and checked up on RGV.
>
> While i stand by my previous post,i am offering a 5 EUROS refund to
> everyone with a damaged box. To claim the refund, please send an email
> with the following subject "colorclash refund" to info DeleteThis @vectrexnews.com
> My mail-program will filter for the subject string, so please use the
> exact subject text. Please provide your paypal address in the email
> and i will send out the refunds asap.
>
> kind regards,
>
> Martijn
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

"Pepijn Bakker" <bakkerp RemoveThis @xs4all.nl> schreef in bericht
news:4491218c$0$31648$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl...
> I'm not in it for the money, I was just dissappointed about such a nice
box
> being damaged, but I appreciate the offer nonetheless , thanks.
>
> I kinda straigthened out the box so I'm okay....
>
> Ah well,
> One day these damaged Color Clash boxes will be collector's items as
> 'one of the first RS games, which was crushed sent in a bubble envelope'
>
> of course this means you have to save the original envelope with it
>
> Pepijn


I like the positive approach you describe.
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

"Chad Tower" <tower.DeleteThis@gis.net> schreef in bericht
news:1150376024.086298.314450@r2g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> Lodewijk van Haringhal wrote:
>
> > why?
>
> Because you have no financial stake in the product. Buy it, receive a
> damaged one, and then tell us we are destroying the homebrew scene.
> Until then, you're just talking.

easy...just copy/paste...

You can not have an opinion on this when you did not buy the homebrew? a
topic starter on Usenet is asking for opinions/answers maybe discussion,
well the only thing I did was giving my opinion on this matter, contributing
to the discussion.

Next to the many positive experiences I had also bad experiences in the past
when buying stuff via the internet in other parts of the world, sometimes
this had to do with shipping or bad packaging. On the other hand I collect
Vextrex items and homebrews...
On the base of these experiences I built the arguments for my opinion on
this topic.

What is the big deal with my opinion? Get a life and see it as a one man's
opinion... btw you are right I'am just talking and you are talking and
barking
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

> Lodewijk van Haringhal wrote:
>
> >
> > You can not have an opinion on this when you did not buy the homebrew?
>
> You can have all the opinions you want and you can express them all you
> want.

*thank you*
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

You seem to have alot to say for yourself Marc Goldman.

Nubian.
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

great topic chris!

I pondered about this myself a while as well, and especially with
recent events has me considering these very same issues.

Debris was my first release and i didn't know much about howmany
copies i would sell or anything, so i figured a 100 pieces was a good
number. i kept the number op exclusives to 20 because i was predicting
a lot of work on the overlays.

With the latest release colorclash, i ment for the gameplay to blend
with the overlay, so therefore i couldn't make any deluxe or none
deluxe version. the overlay is part of the game, therefore is just the
version with overlay.

I think economically-wise there isn't much of a difference going for
Limited or non-limited releases. I would guess that most of John's
games would have sold/generated more over the years than a limited
game would.
As for my personal experience, i found out the hard way of how many
extra costs and efforts are involved in adding extra value in the
product, and how much you'd have to invest. So theoretically i would
have been better off just releasing a regular release, but like i
stated before because of the way colorclash was designed it could only
be released like this i think.

Some people that know me well enough to know what kind of effort and
money i had to poor into the current products have come up to me and
asked me things like "why not do a one-off uber-omega-plus release
version of your product"? But i don't want to do that, because i don't
think it will add a lot of actual hands-on value to the product, other
than making it a rarity. I do have a few ideas in the back of my head
which will could have a small release, but these would rather be
original products than a variation of a game.

For future games i have no idea. I have some things in mind which will
have a cheap release (around 19 euros), and some more elaborate ideas
which will require a larger end user price, and stuff in between those
ranges. Multiple editions/releases/versions of a product are a good
option, IF the product design allows it that is. I think with me the
product will more or less dictate the format of the release.

Martijn


On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 18:45:57 GMT, "Chris Romero"
<nospamto-cromero-please.DeleteThis@romero.org> wrote:

>
>"Marc Goldman" <marc.DeleteThis@countinghouse.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:n2Rjg.14254$n13.6396@newsfe2-win.ntli.net...
>>
>> <rob.ocelot.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1150271298.040189.143130@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
>>> How in the heck are collectors killing the homebrew scene WHEN WE ARE
>>> THE CONSUMERS? (you know, the ones who fork over the money?) If we
>>> didn't exist, homebrewers would have a lot of unsold product sitting
>>> around. An IRC colleague of mine was a pioneering homebrew developer
>>> and it took more than TWO YEARS to sell through 100 copies of his game.
>>
>> Rob, I think you have hit the nail on the head, and it is something that
>> has been bothering me for a while.
>>
>> The 'Limited Edition' thing is what is going to kill homebrew here as it
>> is being over used. If you like to be complete it is forcing the consumer
>> to buy into an unknown, which we all (so far) stupidly do, but if it is
>> the only way we may ever get something without the crazy eBay pricing then
>> we have to roll the dice and take the chance in case we miss out on a gem.
>>
>> The seller gets a lot of sales easily regardless of the standard of the
>> product and thus uses the model again.
>>
>> Colorclash did have the care and attention to it that makes it deserving
>> of that status if you consider the whole package, it just failed to
>> deliver in the end because of a poor distribution model.
>>
>> So I'm beginning to hate limited editions. I can understand why a homebrew
>> developer may only want to release a limited quantity in the special
>> packaging as it must be a pain (and too large a commitment) to produce
>> further packaging, but once that run is sold out then there should be
>> other methods of buying/downloading the game though places like vectrex
>> carts. A few times I've seen statements that a game will never be released
>> by other means, which in my opinion is the real scene killer...
>>
>> Cheers
>> Marc
>>
>>
>
>
>Personally, I think the limited editions are still a good thing to have.
>Especially when the author grants the request to sign the cart. I will be
>the first to say the game does not play any differently that a "standard
>edition" and my enjoyment of the gameplay itself will not change. But to
>get the title out the door faster and recoup some the investment made I do
>think that LE's whet the appetite of some buyers.
>
>The Vectrex community is also fortunate to have authors who have soon
>released standard edition as non-LE carts / boards / downloads / multi-cart
>additions provided by either the author or another Vectrex software
>packager. These releases serve to satisfy the pure game player. Thanks to
>all the authors who release these standard editions. (John George, Alex,
>Ville, Chris, and a whole host of other great people)
>
>But even without and special version or any personalization I would still
>kick in cash to purchase the final version. I have in fact done so in the
>past even after receiving the final beta copy for play testing. The game
>designer, coder, sound artist, graphics artist, manual designer/editor,
>hardware designer, and box designer all deserve my support before and after
>the release. In the Vectrex community these task usually fall all on one or
>two people. They are all a great lot of people and keep our platform perky.
>
>Of course there are those buyers who purchase only to flip the item for a
>quick profit. (e.g. SK multi-cart). But at least the author has some for of
>immediate confirmation their work was not completed in vain. If the title
>gets flipped for double the price then this just proves the next title may
>be able to sell for more justifying a larger time and money investment to
>make an all around quality product. For the longer term the author/team
>will still get to enjoy the reviews by the Vectrex community in general.
>
>I would love to hear more of what the authors/teams think about this subject
>as relates to the Vectrex homebrew scene. For those like John, Sean, Alex,
>Richard, Martijn, etc who have produced products for multiple platforms I
>would love to here your homebrew experiences in the other scenes and how
>they compare with the Vectrex.
>
> Sincerely,
>
>Chris
>cromero at romero dot org
>
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

> asked me things like "why not do a one-off uber-omega-plus release
> version of your product"? But i don't want to do that, because i don't
> think it will add a lot of actual hands-on value to the product, other
> than making it a rarity.


I do just that. Oddly enough, I call it THE OMEGA EDITION.
I've been doing it since 2003. I will continue to do it. I do it
because it signifies the end of the game's release. I end
my game releases because I like to move on to new projects.
Of course, to date I've only charged $20 to $30 for my games,
so if you do the math, you'll find that I profit far less than those
charging much, much more (even when factoring in any special
editions that I release). For example, I've never grossed $7000
for a 100-cart game release, and would feel guilty doing so.

George
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

George... with your track record and KNOWN abilities, I for one would
not blink if you raised your prices enough to gross a bit more. You
have proven that your games are worth it even without an overlay or
pretty box. WOTR and I, Cyborg are top quality games. I play the hell
out of both of them.
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

Chad Tower wrote:
> George... with your track record and KNOWN abilities, I for one would
> not blink if you raised your prices enough to gross a bit more. You
> have proven that your games are worth it even without an overlay or
> pretty box. WOTR and I, Cyborg are top quality games. I play the hell
> out of both of them.


Thanks Chad. My next game projects will be in 3D color. After that,
I may consider overlays...but then that means a bigger box too : )


George
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund 

FURY wrote:

> Thanks Chad. My next game projects will be in 3D color. After that,
> I may consider overlays...but then that means a bigger box too : )


Heh. You mean you can't design an overlay that fits in the little
plastic box?

I probably spent 100 hours playing WOTR with my PSX->vec adapter when
the game first came out. The original PS1 controller is awesome for
that game. I just wish I could find my damn adapter, it's completely
lost in my jungle of a house.

As always, when your next game is ready for preorder, put me on the
notification list.
 >> Stay informed about: colorclash refund