Growing food in a TL 13 society

I think these have all been great ideas and some I have thought about others
have been new to me thanks.

I am using 3rd edition rules and TL's

The PC's are only TL 8/9 and are in way over their heads but that is the
best part.
The base was built by Martians 1000's of years ago as a last stand type
place against Nanobots that they created that was destroying Mars.
They shell of the place is Nano proof and uses Total conversion power plants
for energy of course.
It is at least 10 km tall pyramid shaped and has over 100 floors of plazas,
residents, administration and storage places.
I asked the questions to see add flavour so to speak to the game and will be
been able to use some of the ideas I hope very soon.

If anybody has any cool ideas about the Mundane items that may be around
that would be nice to hear about also.




"David Johnston" <rgorman.DeleteThis@block.net> wrote in message
news:0h8c82dmeul8hvpslhgqcf17dgvi5536mi@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 04 Jun 2006 16:08:22 GMT, "Joe and Barb Dugggan"
> <jbduggan.DeleteThis@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>>I am running a Space based Campaign in which the players have found a TL
>>13
>>hide away outpost hidden under the Martian soil.
>>I was wondering what type of food processing they would have in a place
>>like that?
>>What advances have been made in food growth in a TL 13 society.
>>Is just genetically engineered food? Is it something else?
>>Any cool ideas would be appreciated.
>>
>>Also what type of mundane things could be in a place like this?
>>
>>Any links to site that have this type of thing would be cool.
>>
>>Thanks for the help
>>
>
> Incidentally how advanced are the PCs? Was the outpost built by
> humans or aliens? And which edition of the game are you talking
> about?
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

On Tue, 06 Jun 2006 18:03:26 +0200, Ingo Siekmann
<Ingo-Siekmann RemoveThis @web.de> wrote:

>Bruce Grubb schrieb:
>-snip
>> TL(x+y) that is equivalent to whatever TL13 you plan on using.
>>
>> Each brings with it own set of idea and concepts.
>
>Which brings up another question - is our current agriculture really TL
>8, or is it TL (1+7), or maybe Tl (3+5)?
>
>AFAIK, the basics did not changed that much - dig a hole, put a seed in
>it, wait a few months and pray for luck.

Selective breeding, crop rotation, fertiliser, pesticides,
'artificial' fertiliser, 'artificial' pesticides, GM/GE, ploughing,
'heavy' ploughs, combine harvesters, mechanical seeding machines...
I'd say there have been a few improvements along the way.

It's not the 'basics' that determine TL, but how you go about them. If
it was the basics that matter military technology would be TL1+X or
thereabouts - a rifle bullet is just a high grade sling bullet that's
propelled differently.
--
Rupert Boleyn <rboleyn RemoveThis @paradise.net.nz>
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

David Johnston <rgorman.DeleteThis@block.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 00:09:49 GMT, forkliftramp.com
> <Brian_knowspam.McDonald.DeleteThis@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>>we're also assuming that people at tl 13 still eat the way we think of
>>it.
>
> There's no good reason not to.

There are a lot of good reasons not to. You have to lug food around with
you wherever you decide to live. Why not just drink water (easy to get
just about anywhere) in order to replenish your fluids, and have a
tiny implanted total conversion plant turn part of that water into
energy with which it turns your waste back into food. No reason to
poop and pee all that precious organic matter out of your body, after
all.


mcv.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

In article <U2rhg.251213$WI1.145142@pd7tw2no>,
"Joe and Barb Dugggan" <jbduggan RemoveThis @shaw.ca> wrote:

> I think these have all been great ideas and some I have thought about others
> have been new to me thanks.
>
> I am using 3rd edition rules and TL's

That still leaves TL(x+y) because that came in with GURPS 3e Steampunk. In
fact things are a little messed up with TL(x+y) in 3e as TL(5+1) and TL6
were used interchangably even though they clearly were not.


Outside sci-fi the only real world thing close to a TL(5+1) vs TL6 is
Edison's Kinetophone vs Laustes sound on film method.

Edisons 1898 Kinetophone (Speaking Mutoscope in Steampunk) which was later
improved to the Videophone (used in The Jazz Singer in 1927) used the
mechanical means so common to TL5 to sync picture and sound while Lauste's
sound on film method (1910) which used electrial means that would be common
in TL6. For a short time Videophone was superior to Laustes method but as
TL6 went along it improved to the point that by 1935 Videophone was dead as
a technology.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

But why not?

With a higher tech level,
perhaps people can do away
with the problems that eating brings:
teeth maintenance for mastication (chewing),
choking (due to our gullet / windpipe intersection),
and possible digestive cancers,
from oesophagus (gullet) down to colon (large intestine).

So how about:
easily swallowed liquid food preparations?
injected, or better still, patch-infused (like nicotine patches) nutrition?
Eating ultra-tech this way seems far more efficient & less wasteful.

Of course,
think of the neglect to our teeth and digestive system,
Then what about the genetic engineering available at TL13+,
that evolves people into transhumans?
Again, in the spirit of Improved lifeforms.

Actually,
I find such "further development" difficult to stomach (pun, yes).
After all, I'm against head jacking
(plugging smart gadgets direct into the brain),
when it finally arrives.

But the future does not have to listen to people like us.

Alan Heah
fynyx.RemoveThis@singnet.com.sg

David Johnston wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 00:09:49 GMT, forkliftramp.com
> <Brian_knowspam.McDonald.RemoveThis@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>
>>we're also assuming that people at tl 13 still eat the way we think of
>>it.
>
>
> There's no good reason not to.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

Alan Heah <fynyx.RemoveThis@singnet.com.sg> wrote:
>
> After all, I'm against head jacking
> (plugging smart gadgets direct into the brain),
> when it finally arrives.
>
> But the future does not have to listen to people like us.

Considering the ease with which people are already modifying their
bodies and implanting foreign materials in them, I have absolutely
no illusions about any resistance against cybernetics when they
finally do arrive. I mean, as with piercings and boob jobs, some
people would never even consider it, but others will jump at the
opportunity, and eventually it will become socially acceptable.
Sooner or later.


mcv.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 17:04:08 +0800, Alan Heah <fynyx.DeleteThis@singnet.com.sg>
wrote:

>But why not?

Because people don't use technology to take away their pleasures.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

mcv wrote:
> David Johnston <rgorman.RemoveThis@block.net> wrote:
>> On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 00:09:49 GMT, forkliftramp.com
>> <Brian_knowspam.McDonald.RemoveThis@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> we're also assuming that people at tl 13 still eat the way we think of
>>> it.
>> There's no good reason not to.
>
> There are a lot of good reasons not to. You have to lug food around with
> you wherever you decide to live. Why not just drink water (easy to get
> just about anywhere) in order to replenish your fluids, and have a
> tiny implanted total conversion plant turn part of that water into
> energy with which it turns your waste back into food. No reason to
> poop and pee all that precious organic matter out of your body, after
> all.
>
>
The majority of people may live like this if everything is controlled by
the bean-counters. If the society is more free like some
representations have it they might look at eating as an important part
of their life and look for the meals as an escape. They would want to
do something other than just sip some water.


> mcv.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 14:22:32 -0600, Bruce Grubb <bgrubb.TakeThisOut@zianet.com>
wrote:

>In article <U2rhg.251213$WI1.145142@pd7tw2no>,
> "Joe and Barb Dugggan" <jbduggan.TakeThisOut@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>> I think these have all been great ideas and some I have thought about others
>> have been new to me thanks.
>>
>> I am using 3rd edition rules and TL's
>
>That still leaves TL(x+y) because that came in with GURPS 3e Steampunk.

Oh spare us.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

Michael W. Ryder <_mwryder RemoveThis @worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> mcv wrote:
>> David Johnston <rgorman RemoveThis @block.net> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 00:09:49 GMT, forkliftramp.com
>>> <Brian_knowspam.McDonald RemoveThis @shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> we're also assuming that people at tl 13 still eat the way we think of
>>>> it.
>>> There's no good reason not to.
>>
>> There are a lot of good reasons not to. You have to lug food around with
>> you wherever you decide to live. Why not just drink water (easy to get
>> just about anywhere) in order to replenish your fluids, and have a
>> tiny implanted total conversion plant turn part of that water into
>> energy with which it turns your waste back into food. No reason to
>> poop and pee all that precious organic matter out of your body, after
>> all.
>>
> The majority of people may live like this if everything is controlled by
> the bean-counters. If the society is more free like some
> representations have it they might look at eating as an important part
> of their life and look for the meals as an escape. They would want to
> do something other than just sip some water.

Could be that they already have a lot of other things to do than sip
water. We enjoy food because we're built to, but aliens might be
built differently. Especially if their ancestors decided to build them
more efficiently.


mcv.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

David Johnston <rgorman RemoveThis @block.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 17:04:08 +0800, Alan Heah <fynyx RemoveThis @singnet.com.sg>
> wrote:
>
>>But why not?
>
> Because people don't use technology to take away their pleasures.

But the pleasures of your children might be a totally different matter.
And if you happen to live in conditions where good food is impossible
to get, but you have the opportunity to remove the need for food
altogether, well, some might take it.


mcv.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

On 07 Jun 2006 20:48:12 GMT, mcv <mcvmcv DeleteThis @xs4all.nl> wrote:

>David Johnston <rgorman DeleteThis @block.net> wrote:
>> On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 17:04:08 +0800, Alan Heah <fynyx DeleteThis @singnet.com.sg>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>But why not?
>>
>> Because people don't use technology to take away their pleasures.
>
>But the pleasures of your children might be a totally different matter.
>And if you happen to live in conditions where good food is impossible
>to get,

When you can genetically engineer people to live on nothing but water,
good food is never impossible to get.
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society 

On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 18:35:48 GMT, David Johnston <rgorman RemoveThis @block.net>
wrote:

>On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 17:04:08 +0800, Alan Heah <fynyx RemoveThis @singnet.com.sg>
>wrote:
>
>>But why not?
>
>Because people don't use technology to take away their pleasures.

have you stuck your head out the window lately to appreciate a lungful
of fresh air? or the view of the bucolic countryside? drunk from a
running stream of late?
 >> Stay informed about: Growing food in a TL 13 society