I don't believe it

katy wrote:
> kat wrote:
>> katy wrote:
>>
>>> kat wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Clearly, the consumption in Canada is legendary, but I didn't know
>>>> until today. I have never seen Kraft macaroni and cheese over
>>>> here, it tends to come in tins, labelled Heinz, and isn't orange.
>>>>
>>>
>>> eeewwww..canned pasta...might as well eat paste...
>>
>>
>> I don't much like macaroni and cheese fresh made never mind canned. Or
>> boxed.
>> But when I was a child the only spaghetti I ever saw came out of a
>> tin with tomato sauce - and got served on toast. Think of the
>> carbs! It was school dinners introduced me to spag. bol.
>>
>>
> Yeah...FrancoAmerican canned spaghetti...my Mom would cut up hotdogs
> and put it in...yech...I think things like tht came out of Depression
> thinking...

That and rationing during the war had a lot to answer for!

--
kat
>^..^<
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

kat wrote:

>
> That and rationing during the war had a lot to answer for!
>
My mother was fortunate that she was not living in the US when that
occurred. My Dad, though, has horrendous stories and still bears the
scars of an incidnet. They were farmers. Grandpa had killed the boar and
hung it in the shed which was back-to-back with the privy. Dad went out
late one night to visit the privy and heard noises coming from the shed,
so he went to investigate. He was in his mid-teens at the time. WHen he
opened the shed door, a feral cat was hanging on the side of pork
gnawing away and growling. My Dad was infuriated becasue it was the only
meat they would have for the winter, so he tried to get the cat off the
meat. It sprang on him, claws out, and jumped on his chest. He had rake
marks all teh way from the top of his sternum down to his waist. He
grabbed the cat by the tail and swung it agasinst the wall and killed
it. Then he fed it to the dog. To this day he does not like cats. We had
cats as pets but he would avoid them like the plague. You can still see
the white lines on his body. I doubt that was an isolated thing. He said
that they were at least grateful that they were farmers and had some
food to eat even though they had nothing else. The 3 boys worked the
fields and all managed to get rthrough high school while Grandpa went to
work in the asbestos factory making carpet backing for inflammable
things...he died of lung disease. That was back before class action
suits etc.

We sit and say "Oh, those were the good old days", but they really
weren't. I still remember my Gramma using a tub and washboard in the
late 50's before her kids bought her a wringer washer. And she beat the
rugs and carpeting on the line or over a tree branch becasue she didn't
have a vaccum cleaner. (another presewnt from her boys). Of course, even
though that was a part of my childhood, that is now a half centry ago.
But look at the difference!
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

katy wrote:
> kat wrote:
>
>>
>> That and rationing during the war had a lot to answer for!
>>
> My mother was fortunate that she was not living in the US when that
> occurred. My Dad, though, has horrendous stories and still bears the
> scars of an incidnet. They were farmers. Grandpa had killed the boar
> and hung it in the shed which was back-to-back with the privy. Dad
> went out late one night to visit the privy and heard noises coming
> from the shed, so he went to investigate. He was in his mid-teens at
> the time. WHen he opened the shed door, a feral cat was hanging on
> the side of pork gnawing away and growling. My Dad was infuriated
> becasue it was the only meat they would have for the winter, so he
> tried to get the cat off the meat. It sprang on him, claws out, and
> jumped on his chest. He had rake marks all teh way from the top of
> his sternum down to his waist. He grabbed the cat by the tail and
> swung it agasinst the wall and killed it. Then he fed it to the dog.
> To this day he does not like cats. We had cats as pets but he would
> avoid them like the plague. You can still see the white lines on his
> body. I doubt that was an isolated thing. He said that they were at
> least grateful that they were farmers and had some food to eat even
> though they had nothing else. The 3 boys worked the fields and all
> managed to get rthrough high school while Grandpa went to work in the
> asbestos factory making carpet backing for inflammable things...he
> died of lung disease. That was back before class action suits etc.
>
> We sit and say "Oh, those were the good old days", but they really
> weren't. I still remember my Gramma using a tub and washboard in the
> late 50's before her kids bought her a wringer washer. And she beat
> the rugs and carpeting on the line or over a tree branch becasue she
> didn't have a vaccum cleaner. (another presewnt from her boys). Of
> course, even though that was a part of my childhood, that is now a
> half centry ago. But look at the difference!

Incredible isn't it. I don't think things were quite as bad here in the
30s, but they weren't good. My dad lived in a farming community, but many
people around worked in a local plastics factory. He had a variety of jobs
from leaving school at 14 to the war starting when he was 21. My grandad
retired very early because he had heart trouble and grandma took in
washing. This in a cottage with no running water. Fill the copper and
heat it to to the washing. I have no idea if she had a wringer - I hope so!
I remember my mum getting a wringer washer, I recall the old mangle in the
back garden, along with the tin bath we had in Dundee. I was 16 before we
got a fridge, and about 12 when mum replaced an ancient Goblin cylinder
vacuum with a fancy Hoover Constellation.

We take a lot of things for granted now that we never dreamed of then.


--
kat
>^..^<
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

Gareeth wrote:

.. We
> seldom have snow. I have a palm tree on my lawn.
>
> Gareeth

Just like me then.


--
kat
>^..^<
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

"katy" <katysails DeleteThis @netscape.com> wrote in message
news:6cvgqlF323gU1@mid.individual.net...
> My mother was fortunate that she was not living in the US when that
> occurred. My Dad, though, has horrendous stories and still bears the scars
> of an incidnet. They were farmers. Grandpa had killed the boar and hung it
> in the shed which was back-to-back with the privy. Dad went out late one
> night to visit the privy and heard noises coming from the shed, so he went
> to investigate. He was in his mid-teens at the time. WHen he opened the
> shed door, a feral cat was hanging on the side of pork gnawing away and
> growling. My Dad was infuriated becasue it was the only meat they would
> have for the winter, so he tried to get the cat off the meat. It sprang on
> him, claws out, and jumped on his chest. He had rake marks all teh way
> from the top of his sternum down to his waist.

Ouch - yes, cats can be vicious in a situation like that. Their teeth and
claws are also full of infective stuff. Did he get an infection from that?


He
> grabbed the cat by the tail and swung it agasinst the wall and killed it.
> Then he fed it to the dog. To this day he does not like cats. We had cats
> as pets but he would avoid them like the plague. You can still see the
> white lines on his body. I doubt that was an isolated thing. He said that
> they were at least grateful that they were farmers and had some food to
> eat even though they had nothing else. The 3 boys worked the fields and
> all managed to get rthrough high school while Grandpa went to work in the
> asbestos factory making carpet backing for inflammable things...he died of
> lung disease. That was back before class action suits etc.

Nasssty. It's horrible stuff that.

> We sit and say "Oh, those were the good old days", but they really
> weren't. I still remember my Gramma using a tub and washboard in the late
> 50's before her kids bought her a wringer washer. And she beat the rugs
> and carpeting on the line or over a tree branch becasue she didn't have a
> vaccum cleaner. (another presewnt from her boys). Of course, even though
> that was a part of my childhood, that is now a half centry ago. But look
> at the difference!

Oh, I agree. I never understand people who say things like 'oh, I love the
Victorians. I would have liked to have lived then.' No, you bloody
wouldn't. One round of cholera or something and you'd be gone. This is
especially true of me. If I had had my head operation in any period before
the present, I would be dead or seriously disabled.
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

"katy" <katysails.TakeThisOut@netscape.com> wrote in message
news:6cvgqlF323gU1@mid.individual.net...
> kat wrote:
>
>>
>> That and rationing during the war had a lot to answer for!
>>
> My mother was fortunate that she was not living in the US when that
> occurred. My Dad, though, has horrendous stories and still bears the scars
> of an incidnet. They were farmers. Grandpa had killed the boar and hung it
> in the shed which was back-to-back with the privy. Dad went out late one
> night to visit the privy and heard noises coming from the shed, so he went
> to investigate. He was in his mid-teens at the time. WHen he opened the
> shed door, a feral cat was hanging on the side of pork gnawing away and
> growling. My Dad was infuriated becasue it was the only meat they would
> have for the winter, so he tried to get the cat off the meat. It sprang on
> him, claws out, and jumped on his chest. He had rake marks all teh way
> from the top of his sternum down to his waist. He grabbed the cat by the
> tail and swung it agasinst the wall and killed it. Then he fed it to the
> dog. To this day he does not like cats. We had cats as pets but he would
> avoid them like the plague. You can still see the white lines on his body.
> I doubt that was an isolated thing. He said that they were at least
> grateful that they were farmers and had some food to eat even though they
> had nothing else. The 3 boys worked the fields and all managed to get
> rthrough high school while Grandpa went to work in the asbestos factory
> making carpet backing for inflammable things...he died of lung disease.
> That was back before class action suits etc.
>
> We sit and say "Oh, those were the good old days", but they really
> weren't. I still remember my Gramma using a tub and washboard in the late
> 50's before her kids bought her a wringer washer. And she beat the rugs
> and carpeting on the line or over a tree branch becasue she didn't have a
> vaccum cleaner. (another presewnt from her boys). Of course, even though
> that was a part of my childhood, that is now a half centry ago. But look
> at the difference!

My grandfather tells stories of Berlin during the war. The day the man came
around selling engine oil as cooking oil and three people died in his
street. The eating of 'roof rabbits'. My mother tells others of the
depression that came afterwards. My grandmother facing the Russian soldiers
with her broom in the kitchen. Lining up for bread. Visiting my
great-grandmother's farm and finding an occupied and covered-over foxhole
when plowing a new field.

MM
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

katy wrote:

> I didn't want to say anything about Vancouver because I had been sworn
> to silence by relatives to mever mention the rose gardens...

But you just did. Now what's the reason?


--
kat
>^..^<
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

Madame Mim wrote:
> "katy" <katysails RemoveThis @netscape.com> wrote in message
> news:6cvgqlF323gU1@mid.individual.net...
>> kat wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> That and rationing during the war had a lot to answer for!
>>>
>> My mother was fortunate that she was not living in the US when that
>> occurred. My Dad, though, has horrendous stories and still bears the
>> scars of an incidnet. They were farmers. Grandpa had killed the boar
>> and hung it in the shed which was back-to-back with the privy. Dad
>> went out late one night to visit the privy and heard noises coming
>> from the shed, so he went to investigate. He was in his mid-teens at
>> the time. WHen he opened the shed door, a feral cat was hanging on
>> the side of pork gnawing away and growling. My Dad was infuriated
>> becasue it was the only meat they would have for the winter, so he
>> tried to get the cat off the meat. It sprang on him, claws out, and
>> jumped on his chest. He had rake marks all teh way from the top of
>> his sternum down to his waist. He grabbed the cat by the tail and
>> swung it agasinst the wall and killed it. Then he fed it to the dog.
>> To this day he does not like cats. We had cats as pets but he would
>> avoid them like the plague. You can still see the white lines on his
>> body. I doubt that was an isolated thing. He said that they were at
>> least grateful that they were farmers and had some food to eat even
>> though they had nothing else. The 3 boys worked the fields and all
>> managed to get rthrough high school while Grandpa went to work in
>> the asbestos factory making carpet backing for inflammable
>> things...he died of lung disease. That was back before class action
>> suits etc. We sit and say "Oh, those were the good old days", but they
>> really
>> weren't. I still remember my Gramma using a tub and washboard in the
>> late 50's before her kids bought her a wringer washer. And she beat
>> the rugs and carpeting on the line or over a tree branch becasue she
>> didn't have a vaccum cleaner. (another presewnt from her boys). Of
>> course, even though that was a part of my childhood, that is now a
>> half centry ago. But look at the difference!
>
> My grandfather tells stories of Berlin during the war. The day the
> man came around selling engine oil as cooking oil and three people
> died in his street. The eating of 'roof rabbits'. My mother tells
> others of the depression that came afterwards. My grandmother facing
> the Russian soldiers with her broom in the kitchen. Lining up for
> bread. Visiting my great-grandmother's farm and finding an occupied
> and covered-over foxhole when plowing a new field.
>

It all sounds like another world, doesn't it. And stuff like that - I hope
stays another world.


--
kat
>^..^<
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

"kat" <kat.news.RemoveThis@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:6d0p6nF8ateU1@mid.individual.net...
> It all sounds like another world, doesn't it. And stuff like that - I
> hope stays another world.

Yes.

MM
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

kat wrote:
> katy wrote:
>
>
>>I didn't want to say anything about Vancouver because I had been sworn
>>to silence by relatives to mever mention the rose gardens...
>
>
> But you just did. Now what's the reason?
>
>
Because that's what Gareth was talking about...so I decided maybe people
should know...the Pacific NW is lovely...
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

kat wrote:

>
> It all sounds like another world, doesn't it. And stuff like that - I hope
> stays another world.
>
>
Yes, it should,,,,but...what doesn;t kill you makes you stronger and
much of what we do is based on being raised by parents who had the
wherewithal to survive all that...I am wondering, historically, if the
farther removed you are from historical disaster 9as in say our
grandchildren) how do you develop coping skills to take on with you when
what you're dealing with is so alien in an historical sense? We know and
are appalled by the famine becasue we were raised by parents and
grandparents that experienced it first hand rather than reading about it
in a history text. To anyone under 30 now, al that is just words on
paper rather than a reality so the horror is diminished. I wonder if
that's why history repeats itself? because the horrors diminish? And as
much as we all think war now is a horror, when compared to WW2, VietNam,
etc it's pretty sterile. 2K die in a year over 2K a day or week. (and
that is in no sense a justification)
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

katy said
> kat wrote:
>
>>
>> It all sounds like another world, doesn't it. And stuff like that -
>> I hope stays another world.
>>
>>
> Yes, it should,,,,but...what doesn;t kill you makes you stronger and
> much of what we do is based on being raised by parents who had the
> wherewithal to survive all that...I am wondering, historically, if the
> farther removed you are from historical disaster 9as in say our
> grandchildren) how do you develop coping skills to take on with you
> when what you're dealing with is so alien in an historical sense? We
> know and are appalled by the famine becasue we were raised by parents
> and grandparents that experienced it first hand rather than reading
> about it in a history text. To anyone under 30 now, al that is just
> words on paper rather than a reality so the horror is diminished. I
> wonder if that's why history repeats itself? because the horrors
> diminish? And as much as we all think war now is a horror, when
> compared to WW2, VietNam, etc it's pretty sterile. 2K die in a year
> over 2K a day or week. (and that is in no sense a justification)


Many years ago I read, in a book by Nevil Shute, the theory that wars repeat
because the survivors remember the good bits. It's human nature to prefer
to forget horror and dwell on the fun. Not think of the fighting and death,
but of the camaraderie, the opportunities, etc, and then to want those
things for the next generation, not to the point of starting a war, but not
doing enough to prevent it. I can see where the theory comes from, for
every tale of horror about the 20s 30s and 40s there is one about something
good. As time goes by the bad side is no more than words on a page - and
the good bits get trumpeted by those with axes to grind.

You and me, we lived with parents who lived through those times, we saw
VietNam just about live, on tv. Our kids see a war that as you say is
sterile, the new reports aren't so dramatic. That fewer of our people die
is maybe the reason it continues.

kat on her laptop and where did the sig go?
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it 

kat wrote:

>
> Many years ago I read, in a book by Nevil Shute, the theory that wars repeat
> because the survivors remember the good bits. It's human nature to prefer
> to forget horror and dwell on the fun. Not think of the fighting and death,
> but of the camaraderie, the opportunities, etc, and then to want those
> things for the next generation, not to the point of starting a war, but not
> doing enough to prevent it. I can see where the theory comes from, for
> every tale of horror about the 20s 30s and 40s there is one about something
> good. As time goes by the bad side is no more than words on a page - and
> the good bits get trumpeted by those with axes to grind.
>
Yes, the aggrandizement of war...tally ho! My Dad won't, and never has,
talk about his time in the Pacific. He was at Guam and PagoPago in the
Army Air Corps (now the Air Force) and even though he did not see active
combat because he was a meteorologist, he saw what was going on around
him. He said that it was not something he wanted to share.

> You and me, we lived with parents who lived through those times, we saw
> VietNam just about live, on tv. Our kids see a war that as you say is
> sterile, the new reports aren't so dramatic. That fewer of our people die
> is maybe the reason it continues.

One thing I am thankful for (and it's a horrible horrible thing) is that
there is footage of the concentration camps in Germany. I hope that
efforts are made to retain all that footage so that noone EVER forgets
the atrocities human being are willing to perpetrate on their fellows.
War now is blow up this, blow up that..sniper fire...You are correct..an
undramatic war is as climatic. The other thing is that we become jaded
with info...how many Jeeps can you see blow up before your mind just
registers..oh yeah...that's a Jeep blowing up and the human element is
no longer there. I think it's the same way with sexuality on tv..you
become so calloused to watching it that it no longer has the shock
effect so you just absorb it and it becomes passe and routine.
>
> kat on her laptop and where did the sig go?

Internet Hell? That's where all the unexplainable things go on my puter!
>
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: I don't believe it