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Next: New Releases - 24th April 2006
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External
Since: Jun 01, 2005
Posts: 231
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 3:02 am
Post subject: A couple of questions
Archived from groups: rec>games>frp>dnd (more info?)
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Hi all,
A couple of questions.
1. Is there a feat in one of the 'official' published books out there
that makes a skill a class skill, or several skills into class skills
(regardless of your actual classes). If so, which book, which prereqs,
what is the name of the feat, etc.?
2. Is there a magic item in one of the 'official' published books out
there that adds a (non-resistance) bonus to only one type of save -
e.g. Will saves. Not just for specific save types (bonus on Fort saves,
but only vs. poison, or disease, ...) If so, which books, etc... If
not, what would be a reasonable pricing for an item that either
duplicates the Great Fortitude / Lightning Reflexes / Iron Will feat
(so untyped) or give a, say, +2 typed bonus to one type of save? I
would assume either competence or luck are the most appropriate types.
3. Can you combine a (magic or not) shield, or a buckler, with magic
bracers / bracelets, and gain the benefits of both? The magic item
rules say "One pair of bracers or bracelets on the arms or wrists." but
does not rule out shields / bucklers; shields / bucklers themselves
appear silent on the issue of combining.
4. In the Eberron campaign setting, there is an armor 'darkleaf
breastplate'. Make a masterwork version thereof any you have something
that can almost, but not quite, rival a mithral chain shirt (you get
light armor with an extra +1 AC, but have -1 ACP, lower max. Dex, and
the suit is still heavy; also, spell failure is higher). And the chain
shirt is still cheaper! All that for +1 AC... For a change, I want a
character to NOT walk around in yet another mithral chain shirt. But
the ACP and weight does bother this character. Question is: how much
extra cost would be reasonable to make a darkleaf breastplate
essentially equal to a mithral chain shirt (ACP, weight and
max-Dex-wise). How much is +1 AC (which is not a +1 enhancement) or 1
lower ACP worth?
Thanks in advance for any answers!
Cheers,
Arandor |
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External
Since: Dec 16, 2004
Posts: 142
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 9:43 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Arandor" <arandor.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1146045745.221249.19000@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com...
> Hi all,
>
> A couple of questions.
>
> 1. Is there a feat in one of the 'official' published books out there
> that makes a skill a class skill, or several skills into class skills
> (regardless of your actual classes). If so, which book, which prereqs,
> what is the name of the feat, etc.?
A couple of additional ideas...
NPC Expert gives you any 10 skills as class skills. May or may not meet
your needs.
A number of cleric domains make selected skills class skills.
>
> 3. Can you combine a (magic or not) shield, or a buckler, with magic
> bracers / bracelets, and gain the benefits of both? The magic item
> rules say "One pair of bracers or bracelets on the arms or wrists." but
> does not rule out shields / bucklers; shields / bucklers themselves
> appear silent on the issue of combining.
The magic item slot rules apply to effective magic items only. Shield is
not covered by those rules. So, no restriction, per the RAW, on a shield of
any type along with bracers or bracelets.
>
> 4. In the Eberron campaign setting, there is an armor 'darkleaf
> breastplate'.
Sounds like it's intended as druid armor.
David |
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External
Since: Apr 28, 2004
Posts: 1014
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 9:55 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Arandor wrote:
> Hi all,
G'day.
> 1. Is there a feat in one of the 'official' published books out there
> that makes a skill a class skill, or several skills into class skills
> (regardless of your actual classes).
Yes, somewhere. Any two or any one at +3, birth only, or somesuch.
Lots of versions out there and I wouldn't know which one's most official.
> 2. Is there a magic item in one of the 'official' published books out
> there that adds a (non-resistance) bonus to only one type of save -
> e.g. Will saves.
I'm pretty sure you're just supposed to buy up the resistance and
eventually dig around for appropriate stat buffs and a luck bonus if you
really care. The Shadowstaff has a +4 untyped ref bonus, but artifacts
don't count.
> 3. Can you combine a (magic or not) shield, or a buckler, with magic
> bracers / bracelets, and gain the benefits of both?
Yes. Shields take a hand slot and provide a Shield bonus, while
bracers use the arms slot and provide an Armour bonus.
> 4. [...] How much is +1 AC (which is not a +1 enhancement) or 1 lower
> ACP worth?
+1 AC is worth -1 Max Dex, -1 ACP, and anything up to 1000gp
depending on base AC. Dropping ACP often pays, at the cost of -1 AC.
They don't normally come seperately.
Or try the Dusty Rose ioun stone for 5000gp, +1 insight to AC.
--
tussock
Aspie at work, sorry in advance. >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Dec 16, 2004
Posts: 142
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 9:55 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"tussock" <scrub DeleteThis @clear.net.nz> wrote in message
news:444f736d@clear.net.nz...
> Arandor wrote:
>> 3. Can you combine a (magic or not) shield, or a buckler, with magic
>> bracers / bracelets, and gain the benefits of both?
>
> Yes. Shields take a hand slot and provide a Shield bonus, while
> bracers use the arms slot and provide an Armour bonus.
Heavy shield and tower shield use the hand. Light shield allows you to
carry an item in that hand, but not use a weapon in that hand (other than
the shield itself); think wand, scroll, potion, holy symbol. Buckler leaves
the hand open, and the hand can be used for a weapon or item.
David >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Apr 28, 2004
Posts: 1014
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 1:55 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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David wrote:
> tussock wrote:
>> Arandor wrote:
>
>>> 3. Can you combine a (magic or not) shield, or a buckler, with magic
>>> bracers / bracelets, and gain the benefits of both?
>> Yes. Shields take a hand slot and provide a Shield bonus, while
>> bracers use the arms slot and provide an Armour bonus.
>
> Heavy shield and tower shield use the hand. Light shield allows you to
> carry an item in that hand, but not use a weapon in that hand (other than
> the shield itself); think wand, scroll, potion, holy symbol. Buckler leaves
> the hand open, and the hand can be used for a weapon or item.
All true, though you can't normally /use/ the extra item or weapon
in the hand (or use the hand as your somatic spell component, BTB) and
get the shield bonus in the same round.
You can also wear magic gloves and use a shield, because the hands
slot is different to the hand slot that the shield takes up even when
strapped to your arm. 8]
--
tussock
Aspie at work, sorry in advance. >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Jun 01, 2005
Posts: 231
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 2:06 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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> A couple of additional ideas...
> NPC Expert gives you any 10 skills as class skills. May or may
> not meet your needs.
> A number of cleric domains make selected skills class skills.
Hmm, no, it doesn't. I just want one skill - in particular, Use Magic
Device - as a class skills. A feat seems a big price to pay for that.
Perhaps 'make it a class skill and give it a bonus' (+2?) is
reasonable, but then I wondered, isn't there already such a feat out
there.
> The magic item slot rules apply to effective magic items only. Shield is
> not covered by those rules. So, no restriction, per the RAW, on a shield
> of any type along with bracers or bracelets.
So Bracers of Archery + buckler = just fine, I just don't get the
buckler's AC bonus when I fire, unless I have Improved Buckler Defense.
> Sounds like it's intended as druid armor.
Very possible... But it appealed since I want light armor, allowing
lots of Dex bonus and no ACP. I *could* live without the +1 AC, but if
there is any reasonable price for 'negating' -1 ACP and -1 max. Dex
penalty, that'd be great.
Cheers,
Arandor >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Dec 15, 2005
Posts: 37
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 1:55 pm
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Arandor wrote:
>>A couple of additional ideas...
>>NPC Expert gives you any 10 skills as class skills. May or may
>>not meet your needs.
>>A number of cleric domains make selected skills class skills.
>
>
> Hmm, no, it doesn't. I just want one skill - in particular, Use Magic
> Device - as a class skills. A feat seems a big price to pay for that.
> Perhaps 'make it a class skill and give it a bonus' (+2?) is
> reasonable, but then I wondered, isn't there already such a feat out
> there.
>
>
The standard skill feats are either +2 to 2 different skills or +2 to a
single skill (depending upon which skills).
For something like Use Magic Device that is exclusive, both +2 and make
it a class skill would fairly overpowered (nearly every class [excepting
perhaps a few non-standard classes] that can take it at all has it as a
class skill). For non-exclusive skills, making one a class skill would
probably be reasonably balanced (each skill would basically be 2x to the
skill, so for having 2 ranks in the skill it would even out with the
normal skill feats). As the skill points must still be spent, it should
even out to about 3 or 4 ranks in the skill, if the feat is taken before
any ranks. >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Jul 28, 2005
Posts: 561
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:38 pm
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Arandor wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> A couple of questions.
>
> 1. Is there a feat in one of the 'official' published books out there
> that makes a skill a class skill, or several skills into class skills
> (regardless of your actual classes). If so, which book, which prereqs,
> what is the name of the feat, etc.?
Dragon # 315 has a feat for Living Greyhawk:
Well Read, all Knowledge skills are class skills.
MadKaugh >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Dec 16, 2004
Posts: 142
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 3:54 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Arandor" <arandor.TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1146128786.002591.115990@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> So Bracers of Archery + buckler = just fine, I just don't get the
> buckler's AC bonus when I fire, unless I have Improved Buckler Defense.
You might get some variance on this. Improved Buckler Defense, as written,
applies to off-hand weapon (two weapon fighting), but not necessarily to bow
or two-handed weapon. I'm sure lots would allow it for all, but you should
check with your DM.
David >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Jul 28, 2005
Posts: 561
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 6:38 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Shadow Wolf wrote:
>
> Making UMD a class skill is worth *at least* a feat!
Agreed; UMD is class-unique, like tracking, and tracking
is a feat.
> UMD is incredibly useful.
I haven't found it to be useful, but I anticipate it will be
when I have it at a high level.
MadKaugh >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Jul 28, 2005
Posts: 561
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 6:51 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Arandor wrote:
> Hmm, no, it doesn't. I just want one skill - in particular, Use Magic
> Device - as a class skills. A feat seems a big price to pay for that.
> Perhaps 'make it a class skill and give it a bonus' (+2?) is
> reasonable, but then I wondered, isn't there already such a feat out
> there.
There are two feats, Jack of All Trades and Elf Dilettante,
that let you attempt untrained skills. Elf Dilettante gives
you a +1 to the attempt, but you have to be an Elf to take
it. UMD is a poor match for attempting without ranks to
add to your roll.
MadKaugh >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Jun 01, 2005
Posts: 231
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 7:43 am
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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> Madkaugh wrote:
> > Shadow Wolf wrote:
> > Making UMD a class skill is worth *at least* a feat!
> Agreed; UMD is class-unique, like tracking, and tracking
> is a feat.
Hmm... so sort of 'niche protection' for the Rogue and Bard, I think I
can see that. Not all skills are equal, Listen and Spot are a heck of a
lot more useful, across a heck of a lot more levels, then, say, Craft
or Climb. Plus, UMD is trained-only, so I guess I can see giving a
bonus on top of making a trained only skill into a class skill... OK,
OK.
> > UMD is incredibly useful.
> I haven't found it to be useful, but I anticipate it will be
> when I have it at a high level.
UMD is really only useful if you have it really, REALLY, *R-E-A-L-L-Y*
high. Using just a 5th level scroll takes a UMD check at DC 30 (to
emulate the stat-equivalent minimum of 15, which will be roll - 15, so
effectively this is DC 15 + 15 = DC 30) plus another UMD check of at
least DC 29 (for the DC 20 + caster level). If you don't want to have a
chance of blowing your - at least - 1,125 gp scroll, you'll need at
least a +29...
If you "only" have +25, the chance of failing at least one of these
checks is 32% - not good odds. >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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External
Since: Jul 28, 2005
Posts: 561
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 12:50 pm
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Arandor wrote:
>
> > Madkaugh wrote:
> >
> > > Shadow Wolf wrote:
> > >
> > > Making UMD a class skill is worth *at least* a feat!
> > > UMD is incredibly useful.
> >
> > I haven't found it to be useful, but I anticipate it will be
> > when I have it at a high level.
>
> UMD is really only useful if you have it really, REALLY, *R-E-A-L-L-Y*
> high. Using just a 5th level scroll takes a UMD check at DC 30 (to
> emulate the stat-equivalent minimum of 15, which will be roll - 15, so
> effectively this is DC 15 + 15 = DC 30) plus another UMD check of at
> least DC 29 (for the DC 20 + caster level). If you don't want to have a
> chance of blowing your - at least - 1,125 gp scroll, you'll need at
> least a +29...
Charisma skill, right? Bard would have an investment
in some charisma bonus, but my rogue does not.
So I could hit +29 when I reach level 25.
> If you "only" have +25, the chance of failing at least one of these
> checks is 32% - not good odds.
Yeah, made me question whether UMD is worthwhile.
Consider this, in your scenario, even the bard has say
at least 20 skill points tied up in UMD. You could cover
a lot of the same ground in terms of utility with wands
if you took a single level of another class; not nearly as
flexible, but a lot more reliable and available much earlier.
(No, even with a rogue, I can't afford the skill points. A
rogue needs lots of skills, a rogue is a skills monkey.
Spread yourself over disable, open, spot, search, listen,
hide, move silently, and you're down there with few spare
points to spend, and lots you still want/need.)
You know what might be cool? What if UMD was handled
like Tracking, keyed off another skill, bluff, in this case, but
you need the class feat UMD or take it as a feat. It should
be available to the trickery cleric domain, maybe the magic
one.
MadKaugh >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 1:53 pm
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Madkaugh" <madkaugh.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1146253828.864256.314630@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> You know what might be cool? What if UMD was handled
> like Tracking, keyed off another skill, bluff, in this case, but
> you need the class feat UMD or take it as a feat. It should
> be available to the trickery cleric domain, maybe the magic
> one.
Spellcraft makes a bit mores sense, but then becomes rather redundant.
Cleric Magic domain gives give coverage for a lot of things (arcane wands,
scrolls, etc.). >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 2:54 pm
Post subject: Re: A couple of questions [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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David wrote:
> "Madkaugh" <madkaugh DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1146253828.864256.314630@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > You know what might be cool? What if UMD was handled
> > like Tracking, keyed off another skill, bluff, in this case, but
> > you need the class feat UMD or take it as a feat. It should
> > be available to the trickery cleric domain, maybe the magic
> > one.
>
> Spellcraft makes a bit mores sense, but then becomes rather
> redundant.
Bluff makes sense because the UMD explaination basically says
you (Rogue or Bard) are bluffing the item. Spellcraft would make
sense if there were something similar for arcane-devine crossover
usage or out-of-college, out-of-domain or out-of-alignment usage.
> Cleric Magic domain gives give coverage for a lot of things (arcane
> wands, scrolls, etc.).
.... so Clerics can already do some of that, if they choose that path.
Providing another mechanism would nerf that choice.
MadKaugh >> Stay informed about: A couple of questions |
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