Best combat discipline found with Aus

Sense Death is cool, and I forgot about it (. But you might want to
multi rush.
Also "Aura Reading" is usefull. I put at least two in each deck that
have AUS.
I played fun deck with Saulot Sense death/ Nose of the Hound
+Serenading the Kami+Aura Reading/Vitae block/Weather Control
+Anesthetic Touch/Blood Fury+Taste of Vitae+Telephatic Tracking.
Very card Intensive but fun to play ^)
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> AUS PRE Catatonic Fear Target Vitals with Telepathic Tracking?

Why is this good? If you play CF + TV + TT you pay two blood to do
zero damage, and you move on to another round. TT won't allow the CF
damage to happen. But I guess I misunderstand how you intend to use
the combo.
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On Jan 31, 7:42 am, Malone <kffos....TakeThisOut@indiana.edu> wrote:
> > AUS PRE Catatonic Fear Target Vitals with Telepathic Tracking?
>
> Why is this good? If you play CF + TV + TT you pay two blood to do
> zero damage, and you move on to another round. TT won't allow the CF
> damage to happen. But I guess I misunderstand how you intend to use
> the combo.

I'm pretty sure it works like this: CF does damage whenever combat
happens to end, even if it's not right away. Now if you were to, say,
Psyche after combat ended, you'd lose the after combat effect. But
when you play TT, combat doesn't end yet, and the CF damage is saved
up for later. And since combat ends immediately after your strike,
and then continues with a new round, your opponent's strikes never get
a chance to resolve. Still extremely silly, if you ask me, but I've
only seen the deck *try* to work - it ended up getting screwed by
Grapples and other bad news.
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On Jan 30, 10:42 am, Peter D Bakija <p... RemoveThis @lightlink.com> wrote:

> So some sort of weenie pot/aus deck has a crypt waiting for it, but
> really, what are you going to do with pot/aus weenies? Bounceless
> light intercept and Sewer Lids maybe?

Take the standard mono-potence library. Rip out the Computer Hacks.
Replace with Revelations. Strip out the key combat defense cards of
your prey (or whatever) and rush rush rush.

--

David Cherryholmes
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On Jan 31, 9:22 am, bluedevil <david.cherryhol... DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote:
> Take the standard mono-potence library.  Rip out the Computer Hacks.
> Replace with Revelations.  Strip out the key combat defense cards of
> your prey (or whatever) and rush rush rush.

Hmm. That might work out ok.

-Peter
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Chris Berger wrote:
> On Jan 31, 7:42 am, Malone <kffos....RemoveThis@indiana.edu> wrote:
>>> AUS PRE Catatonic Fear Target Vitals with Telepathic Tracking?
>> Why is this good? If you play CF + TV + TT you pay two blood to do
>> zero damage, and you move on to another round. TT won't allow the CF
>> damage to happen. But I guess I misunderstand how you intend to use
>> the combo.
>
> I'm pretty sure it works like this: CF does damage whenever combat
> happens to end, even if it's not right away.

No. If it's not right away, then the damage from CF is lost.
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On Jan 31, 8:25 am, LSJ <vtes... RemoveThis @white-wolf.com> wrote:
> Chris Berger wrote:
> > On Jan 31, 7:42 am, Malone <kffos... RemoveThis @indiana.edu> wrote:
> >>> AUS PRE Catatonic Fear Target Vitals with Telepathic Tracking?
> >> Why is this good? If you play CF + TV + TT you pay two blood to do
> >> zero damage, and you move on to another round. TT won't allow the CF
> >> damage to happen. But I guess I misunderstand how you intend to use
> >> the combo.
>
> > I'm pretty sure it works like this: CF does damage whenever combat
> > happens to end, even if it's not right away.
>
> No. If it's not right away, then the damage from CF is lost.

Well, then, either I have no idea what that deck I saw was trying to
do, or else neither did the guy that built it. I'm assuming the same
ruling applies to Riposte and to Arianne, though there doesn't seem to
be a general ruling listed on the WW page, and there are no specific
rulings for those cards, unlike specific rulings for CF and
Rotschreck.

I don't want to get into a big argument or anything over this, since
it's not my deck, and I think the concept is silly even if it works,
but this is the RTR that I believe is applied to CF (and by extension
to Riposte and Arianne) to make them fizzle if combat is continued (as
opposed to "restarted", which would be a difference matter):

- Effects that end combat and then do something else after combat (all
in the
single resolution of the effect) will fizzle if combat doesn't end or
if a
new combat is started. (Changes: Rotschreck followed by Fast Reaction
or
Psyche! will nullify the torpor effect.) Note that this doesn't apply
to
end combat and untap effects - the untap effect is not delayed to
after
combat (see Majesty ruling above).

- If an effect resolves and sets up an effect to be resolved later
(e.g.,
Undead Persistence's torpor effect or Siren's Lure's combat), then the
effect will not be canceled by "interruptions" (extending combat/
starting
combat/etc.).

As far as I can tell, CF, Riposte, and Arianne set up an effect to be
resolved later, both by MRP and by specific ruling to Riposte.
Specifically, the wording on CF is "inflict 1 damage to the opposing
minion once combat ends". The "once combat ends" part seems to be
setting up an effect to be resolved later. It really shouldn't matter
if later is right after this strike resolves, or 5 minutes from now
when combat really *does* end.
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Chris Berger wrote:
> As far as I can tell, CF, Riposte, and Arianne set up an effect to be
> resolved later, both by MRP and by specific ruling to Riposte.

No. The effect is part of the resolution of the card. During strike resolution
(the resolution of the card), CF ends combat and inflicts a damage.

> Specifically, the wording on CF is "inflict 1 damage to the opposing
> minion once combat ends". The "once combat ends" part seems to be
> setting up an effect to be resolved later.

It's clarifying the order in which "end combat" and "take damage" are applied.
But bother are "during the resolution of this effect".
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In message <faa91659-79d3-4b12-a5e8-f3dcac0e503a.DeleteThis@e4g2000hsg.googlegroups
..com>, Chris Berger <arkayn.DeleteThis@ugcs.caltech.edu> writes:
>As far as I can tell, CF, Riposte, and Arianne set up an effect to be
>resolved later, both by MRP and by specific ruling to Riposte.

They don't.

When they resolve, combat ends and damage is done. The resolution is
interrupted by TT, Psyche! etc. This is in contrast to, say, Undead
Persistence where the card has fully resolved already, and an effect has
been set up to resolve later.

--
James Coupe
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR.
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING.
13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.
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On Jan 30, 8:53 pm, Peter D Bakija <p....DeleteThis@lightlink.com> wrote:
> So I threw together this deck as a sketch based on this discussion.
> Probably not so good. But maybe?

For what it is worth, I played this deck twice last night:

-Game 1: My prey was a weenie obf/computer hacking deck in a 4 player
game. I was endlessly foiled by, get this, Back Flips and disguised
Flash Grenades. And then Watenda for the extra humiliation. It was
ridiculous. Yet totally hysterical. Weenie Obf sweeps the table,
killing me last.

-Game 2: My prey was some kind of Assamite deck in a 5 player game. I
ended up doing well, as the other guy at the table doing well was a
CHI/DEM deck that conviniently locked down one of my prey's vampires,
and eventually one of my predator's vampires, with Sensory
Deprivation. I end up getting a 3VP table win.

So not horrible in its first go.

> 1x Jeremy McNeil Adv ( AUS, POT, cel
> 1x Jeremy McNeil (7) AUS, POT, cel
> 2x Khallu (7) AUS, CEL, POT
> 2x Homa (6) AUS, CEL, POT
> 2x Kisha Bhimji (5) AUS, cel, pot
> 1x Uzoma (5) POT, aus, cel
> 1x Ismita (4) aus, cel, pot
> 1x Mariano Pomposo (4) aus, cel, pot
> 1x Genghis (3) aus, cel, pot

Crypt isn't bad. I wanna replace regular Jemery McNeil with a second
Advanced. Yeah, I can't get the merge action going, but the built in
Rush is significant.

> 4x Blood Doll
> 3x Wash
> 2x Fame
> 1x Dreams
> 1x Vist from the Capuchin

Taking out the Wash. Replacing them with an Ancestor Spirit (perma +1
bleed) and a Haven Uncovered (maybe a Frontal Assault?). And 1 more
minion card.

> 8x Nose of the Hound
> 8x Telepathic Misdirection
> 8x Ancestor's Insight
> 4x Telepathic Tracking
> 8x Flash
> 6x Pursuit
> 4x Blur
> 8x Sewer Lid
> 4x Stunt Bike
> 4x Thrown Gate
> 8x Wake
> 4x Taste
> 4x Desert Eagle
> 1x Osebo Kholo

Removing Osebo Kholo, 2 Ancestor's Insight and putting in 4x Quicken
Sight.

All in all, I wasn't totally horrified by the performance. And I like
getting some mileage out of the Osebo.

-Peter
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On Feb 3, 6:27 am, Peter D Bakija <p....TakeThisOut@lightlink.com> wrote:
> > 1x Jeremy McNeil Adv ( AUS, POT, cel
> > 1x Jeremy McNeil (7) AUS, POT, cel
> > 2x Khallu (7) AUS, CEL, POT
> > 2x Homa (6) AUS, CEL, POT
> > 2x Kisha Bhimji (5) AUS, cel, pot
> > 1x Uzoma (5) POT, aus, cel
> > 1x Ismita (4) aus, cel, pot
> > 1x Mariano Pomposo (4) aus, cel, pot
> > 1x Genghis (3) aus, cel, pot
>
> Crypt isn't bad. I wanna replace regular Jemery McNeil with a second
> Advanced. Yeah, I can't get the merge action going, but the built in
> Rush is significant.

Unless the ruling on Epiphany has gotten changed, you could run a
number of those. Any deck I'd want to merge anyone, it would be so
tempting to run a minimum of 2 copies.

> > 4x Blood Doll
> > 3x Wash
> > 2x Fame
> > 1x Dreams
> > 1x Vist from the Capuchin
>
> Taking out the Wash. Replacing them with an Ancestor Spirit (perma +1
> bleed) and a Haven Uncovered (maybe a Frontal Assault?). And 1 more
> minion card.

Can take Washes out or not, but mostly, I don't see why you are
playing so few master cards in the first place. As much as this deck
could burn up a lot of cards in a combat and find itself choking, you
should be able to make the combat less card intensive and make better
use of the master phase. I'd even play some skill cards. You may
survive some random bloodhunt or you may draw them. Pursuit, Blur,
Thrown Gate, and Stunt Cycle are all hurting at inferior.

> > 8x Nose of the Hound
> > 8x Telepathic Misdirection
> > 8x Ancestor's Insight
> > 4x Telepathic Tracking
> > 8x Flash
> > 6x Pursuit
> > 4x Blur
> > 8x Sewer Lid
> > 4x Stunt Bike
> > 4x Thrown Gate
> > 8x Wake
> > 4x Taste
> > 4x Desert Eagle
> > 1x Osebo Kholo

Speaking of those cards hurting at inferior, how about losing the
Stunt Cycles and maybe some Thrown Gates for some sort of dodge
(again, much better if you have CEL for the likes of Side Strike or
Sideslip or Acrobatics) and upping the number of Telepathic Trackings.

> Removing Osebo Kholo, 2 Ancestor's Insight and putting in 4x Quicken
> Sight.

One theory I haven't done much with is the idea of establishing a
solid voting presence in combat decks. Nevermind diablerie, it helps
a ton to get casual benefits rather than casual pain from vote decks.
Of course, what the vote deck should do is blow these sorts of decks
off the table, but I so rarely see that sort of thinking.

Anyway, not suggesting you keep the Kholo so much as have more of a
plan for votes from Delaying Tacticsing the Reckless Agitations to
DIing the random annoyances.

> All in all, I wasn't totally horrified by the performance. And I like
> getting some mileage out of the Osebo.

Mostly, I'd want to add some permanentness to the deck from blood
gain, to bleed, to whatever and thin out some of the highly redundant
combat. As it stands, it comes across as highly inflexible, though
Quicken Sight helps some with that.

A copy or two of Legend of the Leopard wouldn't be out of place
either. You can pretend they are extra rush cards.

> -Peter
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> Unless the ruling on Epiphany has gotten changed, you could run a
> number of those.  Any deck I'd want to merge anyone, it would be so
> tempting to run a minimum of 2 copies.

I think in the long run, the merge isn't really important--I mean, it
is nice to get the 2 votes, but I think I'd be better of with two of
the guys who can rush. Which then leads me to thinking "Huh. Why
aren't I just using Massassi instead?", as she has built in Rush (with
a manuever), is Laibon, *and* has CEL. All for 1 more point. But the
line between an 8 cap and a 9 cap seems significant in my head. But
maybe if I were smart, I'd just go with Massassi instead.

> Can take Washes out or not, but mostly, I don't see why you are
> playing so few master cards in the first place.  As much as this deck
> could burn up a lot of cards in a combat and find itself choking, you
> should be able to make the combat less card intensive and make better
> use of the master phase.

Rush tech means low masters to avoid jamming. And also means you have
the fewer masters more often. You cycle a lot of cards. So you don't
want a lot of masters. As they jam up the engine. But as you cycle a
lot of cards, you see the masters you have more often anyway.
Especially with Dreams and/or Visit (which should proabbly be a second
Dreams instead, but I think I ran out of Dreams)

> I'd even play some skill cards.  You may
> survive some random bloodhunt or you may draw them.  Pursuit, Blur,
> Thrown Gate, and Stunt Cycle are all hurting at inferior.

Sure, but there is enough of everything to make it all work out ok--
plenty of POT (7). Not enough CEL (4) to be worth worry about having
it (i.e. I plan on only using cel, but if I get some use out of CEL,
awesome!). Consequently, I swapped out the Pursuits for a couple more
Flash, a couple more Telepathic Tracking, and turned the 4 Blur into 6
Acrobatics (most of the time, I won't have CEL, so it is only getting
me 1 additional anyway; I don't have a metric ton of strikes, so
getting 3 off in a row is unlikely, unless I have a gun; the
occasional Dodge is probably a good thing to be able to take advantage
of, I figure).
>
> > > 8x Nose of the Hound

> Speaking of those cards hurting at inferior, how about losing the
> Stunt Cycles and maybe some Thrown Gates for some sort of dodge
> (again, much better if you have CEL for the likes of Side Strike or
> Sideslip or Acrobatics) and upping the number of Telepathic Trackings.

Yeah, I thought about ditching the Stunt Cycles, but really, at
inferior, they aren't much worse than at superior (they do 3 damage
and prevent 1, which is great against, like, Ivory Bow tech, and they
still get foiled by cel in any case)--maybe now that I have some
Dodges in there, swapping them for more Sewer Lids is probably the way
to go. The Gates are in there just for the occasional extra manuever.
But yeah, I like the dodge option from Acrobatics.

> One theory I haven't done much with is the idea of establishing a
> solid voting presence in combat decks.  Nevermind diablerie, it helps
> a ton to get casual benefits rather than casual pain from vote decks.
> Of course, what the vote deck should do is blow these sorts of decks
> off the table, but I so rarely see that sort of thinking.

Oh, sure--Eurobrujah are great for that. But in this case, I think the
1 prayer card of Kholo is a tad dubious. Won't come up in hand much,
even when it does, it often won't get any play at all.

> Mostly, I'd want to add some permanentness to the deck from blood
> gain, to bleed, to whatever and thin out some of the highly redundant
> combat.  As it stands, it comes across as highly inflexible, though
> Quicken Sight helps some with that.

Taste works for blood gain (being at long all the time helps a lot
with blood loss, too). The combat is reasonably effective in most
situations. It bounces a lot. It can light intercept. It has
reasonable ousting potential. Some permanent combat (guns). Seems
pretty flexible to me

> A copy or two of Legend of the Leopard wouldn't be out of place
> either.  You can pretend they are extra rush cards.

Hmm. Interesting.

-Peter
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On Feb 3, 11:28 am, Peter D Bakija <p... DeleteThis @lightlink.com> wrote:
> > Can take Washes out or not, but mostly, I don't see why you are
> > playing so few master cards in the first place.  As much as this deck
> > could burn up a lot of cards in a combat and find itself choking, you
> > should be able to make the combat less card intensive and make better
> > use of the master phase.
>
> Rush tech means low masters to avoid jamming. And also means you have
> the fewer masters more often. You cycle a lot of cards. So you don't
> want a lot of masters. As they jam up the engine. But as you cycle a
> lot of cards, you see the masters you have more often anyway.
> Especially with Dreams and/or Visit (which should proabbly be a second
> Dreams instead, but I think I ran out of Dreams)

You only had 8 rushes and one copy of a vampire with built in rush -
it's not much of a rush deck; adding intercept won't make it more so,
either. As it stands, it's only a rush deck because it isn't much of
anything else (has some theoretical bruise bleed angle with Insight).
Add some intercept (like you intend) and it's an intercept combat deck
with Nose of the Hound for casual rush.

And, the point I was getting at is the combat is too card intensive
currently. The less the deck is thought of as a rush deck, the less
need it has to win combats and the more slots that can be spent on
something better, like masters.

BTW, any particular reason not to play Dominique Santo Paulo?
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