Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3.

"Mark Johnson" <mark-johnson RemoveThis @freeola.com> wrote in message
news:fvg40n$t0r$1@energise.enta.net...
> haha wrote:
>> http://www.joystiq.com/2008/05/02/rumorang-xbox-360-blu-ray-console-shipping-q3/
>> http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20080502PB200.html
>>
>> I did expect MS to roll out a BR addon, but was rather surprised to
>> hear that it's going to be internal.
>>
>> If I didn't have my PS3, I probably would trade in my current 360 for
>> this one for sure when it comes out because it would be nice to have a
>> BR player, but also purely to play my games in quiet and peace. I
>> still can't believe how noisy my 360 is compared to my PS3.
>
> Don't think that would be a good idea.
>
> 1. It's slow as hell, Microsoft would have to bring out a patch to install
> the games (like the PS3)

But doesn't the BR player read DVD format also, and at a different read
speed with the DVD read diode 9which would still be 12x or even 16x by
then)? BR reads @2x on the PS3, but there are already 6x readers now. If MS
goes this route, I would bet by then the 6x would be the standard, that
would make BR better than the current 12x DVD drive in the 360 for read
speed.

> 2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future games
> were release on Blu-ray only.

Well, it would fall along the line of those who don't have the 360 premium
that came out with HDMI and true 1080p too, I am in tha camp, but it didn't
bother me. Early adopters can't expect things not to change so they remain
happy.

>
> Yes I know Dev's like Rockstar said the GTA IV might be the last one for
> the 360, because of storage space (must find the link) and maybe thats why
> Microssoft would do something like this. But damn, I know I'd be pissed
> off if this happens.

If MS goes the BR route, I wonder why Rockstar would leave a great potential
to make money since the larger capacity foramt would be there on the 360. If
MS doesn't go to the BR route, then I would say Rockstar should abandon the
360.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 2, 6:32 pm, "Tom" <no....DeleteThis@nothere.com> wrote:
> "Mark Johnson" <mark-john....DeleteThis@freeola.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fvg40n$t0r$1@energise.enta.net...
>
>
>
> > haha wrote:
> >>http://www.joystiq.com/2008/05/02/rumorang-xbox-360-blu-ray-console-s...
> >>http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20080502PB200.html
>
> >> I did expect MS to roll out a BR addon, but was rather surprised to
> >> hear that it's going to be internal.
>
> >> If I didn't have my PS3, I probably would trade in my current 360 for
> >> this one for sure when it comes out because it would be nice to have a
> >> BR player, but also purely to play my games in quiet and peace. I
> >> still can't believe how noisy my 360 is compared to my PS3.
>
> > Don't think that would be a good idea.
>
> > 1. It's slow as hell, Microsoft would have to bring out a patch to install
> > the games (like the PS3)
>
> But doesn't the BR player read DVD format also, and at a different read
> speed with the DVD read diode 9which would still be 12x or even 16x by
> then)? BR reads @2x on the PS3, but there are already 6x readers now. If MS
> goes this route, I would bet by then the 6x would be the standard, that
> would make BR better than the current 12x DVD drive in the 360 for read
> speed.

It doesn't matter if it could still read DVDs if Microsoft is doing it
so developers can put games on Blu-Ray discs...

And if they're not doing this so developers can put games on Blu-Ray
discs, there's really no point in doing it. Microsoft's smart enough
not to waste money like that so if this really is true, you can bet
they'll let developers start using Blu-Ray as a game format.

> > 2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future games
> > were release on Blu-ray only.
>
> Well, it would fall along the line of those who don't have the 360 premium
> that came out with HDMI and true 1080p too, I am in tha camp, but it didn't
> bother me. Early adopters can't expect things not to change so they remain
> happy.

You can play games just fine with or without HDMI. Most people would
experience no difference in visual quality.

You can't play games on BDs if you only have a DVD drive.

> > Yes I know Dev's like Rockstar said the GTA IV might be the last one for
> > the 360, because of storage space (must find the link) and maybe thats why
> > Microssoft would do something like this. But damn, I know I'd be pissed
> > off if this happens.
>
> If MS goes the BR route, I wonder why Rockstar would leave a great potential
> to make money since the larger capacity foramt would be there on the 360. If
> MS doesn't go to the BR route, then I would say Rockstar should abandon the
> 360.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 2, 9:22 pm, The alMIGHTY N <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On May 2, 6:32 pm, "Tom" <no....DeleteThis@nothere.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Mark Johnson" <mark-john....DeleteThis@freeola.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:fvg40n$t0r$1@energise.enta.net...
>
> > > haha wrote:
> > >>http://www.joystiq.com/2008/05/02/rumorang-xbox-360-blu-ray-console-s...
> > >>http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20080502PB200.html
>
> > >> I did expect MS to roll out a BR addon, but was rather surprised to
> > >> hear that it's going to be internal.
>
> > >> If I didn't have my PS3, I probably would trade in my current 360 for
> > >> this one for sure when it comes out because it would be nice to have a
> > >> BR player, but also purely to play my games in quiet and peace. I
> > >> still can't believe how noisy my 360 is compared to my PS3.
>
> > > Don't think that would be a good idea.
>
> > > 1. It's slow as hell, Microsoft would have to bring out a patch to install
> > > the games (like the PS3)
>
> > But doesn't the BR player read DVD format also, and at a different read
> > speed with the DVD read diode 9which would still be 12x or even 16x by
> > then)? BR reads @2x on the PS3, but there are already 6x readers now. If MS
> > goes this route, I would bet by then the 6x would be the standard, that
> > would make BR better than the current 12x DVD drive in the 360 for read
> > speed.
>
> It doesn't matter if it could still read DVDs if Microsoft is doing it
> so developers can put games on Blu-Ray discs...

Did I say it mattered, I just simply added the fact that BR can read
DVDs, what else did I say that implied something else? You sometimes
read to far into things. But I added that if MS goes that route, they
will probably go with a faster read diode for the BR, making it have
more data reading capabilities than the current 12xDVD that is in use
now.

>
> And if they're not doing this so developers can put games on Blu-Ray
> discs, there's really no point in doing it. Microsoft's smart enough
> not to waste money like that so if this really is true, you can bet
> they'll let developers start using Blu-Ray as a game format.

No doubt about that.

>
> > > 2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future games
> > > were release on Blu-ray only.
>
> > Well, it would fall along the line of those who don't have the 360 premium
> > that came out with HDMI and true 1080p too, I am in tha camp, but it didn't
> > bother me. Early adopters can't expect things not to change so they remain
> > happy.
>
> You can play games just fine with or without HDMI. Most people would
> experience no difference in visual quality.
>
> You can't play games on BDs if you only have a DVD drive.

I was making a simple comparison because I saw quite a few people here
got pissed when MS made the 360 with true HDMI and 1080p built in, so
it did make some difference. I was not comparing the format difference
or lack thereof, just the reaction some had by having the default
1080i non-HDMI 360 as compared to when MS released the model that have
true HDMI and 1080p.

>
> > > Yes I know Dev's like Rockstar said the GTA IV might be the last one for
> > > the 360, because of storage space (must find the link) and maybe thats why
> > > Microssoft would do something like this. But damn, I know I'd be pissed
> > > off if this happens.
>
> > If MS goes the BR route, I wonder why Rockstar would leave a great potential
> > to make money since the larger capacity foramt would be there on the 360. If
> > MS doesn't go to the BR route, then I would say Rockstar should abandon the
> > 360.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 2, 9:22 pm, The alMIGHTY N <natle....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On May 2, 6:32 pm, "Tom" <no....RemoveThis@nothere.com> wrote:

>
> > > 2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future games
> > > were release on Blu-ray only.
>
> > Well, it would fall along the line of those who don't have the 360 premium
> > that came out with HDMI and true 1080p too, I am in tha camp, but it didn't
> > bother me. Early adopters can't expect things not to change so they remain
> > happy.
>
> You can play games just fine with or without HDMI. Most people would
> experience no difference in visual quality.
>
> You can't play games on BDs if you only have a DVD drive.
>

I need to reply to this part again.
Where did I say playing games was an issue with or without HDMI?
Where did I say you could play BDs on a DVD drive?

Those comments you made were not anything close to being to what I
replied to in regard to #2 of what Mark said.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On Fri, 02 May 2008 23:18:06 +0100, Mark Johnson
<mark-johnson.DeleteThis@freeola.com> wrote:

>haha wrote:
>> http://www.joystiq.com/2008/05/02/rumorang-xbox-360-blu-ray-console-shipping-q3/
>> http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20080502PB200.html
>>
>> I did expect MS to roll out a BR addon, but was rather surprised to
>> hear that it's going to be internal.
>>
>> If I didn't have my PS3, I probably would trade in my current 360 for
>> this one for sure when it comes out because it would be nice to have a
>> BR player, but also purely to play my games in quiet and peace. I
>> still can't believe how noisy my 360 is compared to my PS3.
>
>Don't think that would be a good idea.
>
>1. It's slow as hell, Microsoft would have to bring out a patch to
>install the games (like the PS3)

Not necessarily. Microsoft could use a different, faster Blu-ray
drive.

>
>2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future
>games were release on Blu-ray only.

If this happens it's very, very likely the addon will be for movies
only. There's no way they'd split the userbase so late in the game.

>
>Yes I know Dev's like Rockstar said the GTA IV might be the last one for
>the 360, because of storage space (must find the link) and maybe thats
>why Microssoft would do something like this. But damn, I know I'd be
>pissed off if this happens.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On Fri, 2 May 2008 18:41:42 -0700 (PDT), Tom <jimvernes.RemoveThis@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>
>I was making a simple comparison because I saw quite a few people here
>got pissed when MS made the 360 with true HDMI and 1080p built in, so
>it did make some difference. I was not comparing the format difference
>or lack thereof, just the reaction some had by having the default
>1080i non-HDMI 360 as compared to when MS released the model that have
>true HDMI and 1080p.

Every 360 can do 1080p over component and VGA, though not all TVs can
accept such signals.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

Well, *if* it's true (big if), and we have to pay the price of a new
console for Blu Ray, why would we NOT spend the money on a PS3?
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 2, 9:41 pm, Tom <jimver... DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
> On May 2, 9:22 pm, The alMIGHTY N <natle... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On May 2, 6:32 pm, "Tom" <no... DeleteThis @nothere.com> wrote:
>
> > > "Mark Johnson" <mark-john... DeleteThis @freeola.com> wrote in message
>
> > >news:fvg40n$t0r$1@energise.enta.net...
>
> > > > haha wrote:
> > > >>http://www.joystiq.com/2008/05/02/rumorang-xbox-360-blu-ray-console-s...
> > > >>http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20080502PB200.html
>
> > > >> I did expect MS to roll out a BR addon, but was rather surprised to
> > > >> hear that it's going to be internal.
>
> > > >> If I didn't have my PS3, I probably would trade in my current 360 for
> > > >> this one for sure when it comes out because it would be nice to have a
> > > >> BR player, but also purely to play my games in quiet and peace. I
> > > >> still can't believe how noisy my 360 is compared to my PS3.
>
> > > > Don't think that would be a good idea.
>
> > > > 1. It's slow as hell, Microsoft would have to bring out a patch to install
> > > > the games (like the PS3)
>
> > > But doesn't the BR player read DVD format also, and at a different read
> > > speed with the DVD read diode 9which would still be 12x or even 16x by
> > > then)? BR reads @2x on the PS3, but there are already 6x readers now. If MS
> > > goes this route, I would bet by then the 6x would be the standard, that
> > > would make BR better than the current 12x DVD drive in the 360 for read
> > > speed.
>
> > It doesn't matter if it could still read DVDs if Microsoft is doing it
> > so developers can put games on Blu-Ray discs...
>
> Did I say it mattered, I just simply added the fact that BR can read
> DVDs, what else did I say that implied something else?

So you posted a fact that everyone here knows simply for the sake of
posting it?

> You sometimes read to far into things.

I can only read what's written and respond thusly.

> But I added that if MS goes that route, they
> will probably go with a faster read diode for the BR, making it have
> more data reading capabilities than the current 12xDVD that is in use
> now.

What does it matter how fast a drive can read Blu-Ray discs when the
medium in question is DVD? As far as I've been able to tell, an
increase in the read speed of one formt a drive can read doesn't
necessarily indicate an increase in the read speed for other supported
formats.

> > And if they're not doing this so developers can put games on Blu-Ray
> > discs, there's really no point in doing it. Microsoft's smart enough
> > not to waste money like that so if this really is true, you can bet
> > they'll let developers start using Blu-Ray as a game format.
>
> No doubt about that.
>
>
>
> > > > 2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future games
> > > > were release on Blu-ray only.
>
> > > Well, it would fall along the line of those who don't have the 360 premium
> > > that came out with HDMI and true 1080p too, I am in tha camp, but it didn't
> > > bother me. Early adopters can't expect things not to change so they remain
> > > happy.
>
> > You can play games just fine with or without HDMI. Most people would
> > experience no difference in visual quality.
>
> > You can't play games on BDs if you only have a DVD drive.
>
> I was making a simple comparison because I saw quite a few people here
> got pissed when MS made the 360 with true HDMI and 1080p built in, so
> it did make some difference. I was not comparing the format difference
> or lack thereof, just the reaction some had by having the default
> 1080i non-HDMI 360 as compared to when MS released the model that have
> true HDMI and 1080p.

It's a completely different situation. Only a handful of gamers cared
about the lack of HDMI. Almost everyone would care about games coming
out in Blu-Ray.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 2, 10:25 pm, Tom <jimver....RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On May 2, 9:22 pm, The alMIGHTY N <natle....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On May 2, 6:32 pm, "Tom" <no....RemoveThis@nothere.com> wrote:
>
> > > > 2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future games
> > > > were release on Blu-ray only.
>
> > > Well, it would fall along the line of those who don't have the 360 premium
> > > that came out with HDMI and true 1080p too, I am in tha camp, but it didn't
> > > bother me. Early adopters can't expect things not to change so they remain
> > > happy.
>
> > You can play games just fine with or without HDMI. Most people would
> > experience no difference in visual quality.
>
> > You can't play games on BDs if you only have a DVD drive.
>
> I need to reply to this part again.
> Where did I say playing games was an issue with or without HDMI?
> Where did I say you could play BDs on a DVD drive?
>
> Those comments you made were not anything close to being to what I
> replied to in regard to #2 of what Mark said.

I was stating why there's no parallel between the past HDMI issue and
the possible rumored Blu-Ray issue. The HDMI issue upset a small
handful of people who were equipped to take advantage of HDMI in the
first place. The overwhelming majority of the consumer base had no
issue with this or even cared because whether you had HDMI or not, you
could play your games in the same quality (the 1080p issue was with
the television set, not the Xbox 360 itself).

If games were released only on Blu-Ray going forward (which is the
implication of producing an Xbox 360 with an internal Blu-Ray drive as
opposed to just producing a Blu-Ray add-on drive), not a single
current owner would be able to play future games period no matter the
cables or television model they had.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 2, 11:51 pm, Trevor Smithson <trevor_smith....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 02 May 2008 23:18:06 +0100, Mark Johnson
>
> >2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future
> >games were release on Blu-ray only.
>
> If this happens it's very, very likely the addon will be for movies
> only. There's no way they'd split the userbase so late in the game.

The rumor isn't that there's going to be an add-on; the rumor is that
there will be Xbox 360 consoles with Blu-Ray drives built into them.

If this is true and it's not to allow developers to use Blu-Ray as the
game storage format, why on Earth would they bother with internal Blu-
Ray drives?
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 5, 7:18 am, The alMIGHTY N <natle....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On May 2, 11:51 pm, Trevor Smithson <trevor_smith....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 02 May 2008 23:18:06 +0100, Mark Johnson
>
> > >2. The already large install base would be a little pissed if future
> > >games were release on Blu-ray only.
>
> > If this happens it's very, very likely the addon will be for movies
> > only.  There's no way they'd split the userbase so late in the game.
>
> The rumor isn't that there's going to be an add-on; the rumor is that
> there will be Xbox 360 consoles with Blu-Ray drives built into them.
>
> If this is true and it's not to allow developers to use Blu-Ray as the
> game storage format, why on Earth would they bother with internal Blu-
> Ray drives?

It would be up to each individual developer, not MS.

I don't see developers releasing games in BR only disks until the new
360 has at least as many units sold as the current version.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 5, 12:38 pm, glenz....TakeThisOut@dontspammebro.xmission.com (GMAN) wrote:
> In article <aVETj.93252$jH5.81...@newsfe3-win.ntli.net>, "Morgan" <Nos....TakeThisOut@nospam.com> wrote:
> >"The alMIGHTY N" <natle....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:ee7f89a3-a00d-4d90-be26-c1037424137d@m45g2000hsb.googlegroups.com
>
> >> If games were released only on Blu-Ray going forward
> >> (which is the implication of producing an Xbox 360 with
> >> an internal Blu-Ray drive as opposed to just producing a
> >> Blu-Ray add-on drive), not a single current owner would
> >> be able to play future games period no matter the cables
> >> or television model they had.
>
> >Surly to god if they start producing games that are BR only for the 360 MS
> >will also release an external BR drive. Still not a great option seeing as
> >the 360 only has one rear USB connection so people who already use the rear
> >one (wireless dongle mainly I'd have thought) are goign to have a wireless.
>
> USB hub anyone???
>
> >Anyway to get back to my point. Assuming the rumor is true, if the only way
> >to get a BR drive for the 360 is to get a new console then I can't see game
> >developers supporting the format as it will vastly limit the size of the
> >their customer base.

Would you not lose some data transfer speed having to go through a USB
interface?
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3. 

On May 5, 10:33 am, "Morgan" <Nos... DeleteThis @nospam.com> wrote:
> <mordacpreven... DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:2ecbe80d-0606-49d8-bcf5-54440c0533d4@m45g2000hsb.googlegroups.com
>
>
>
> > On May 5, 7:18 am, The alMIGHTY N <natle... DeleteThis @yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
> > > On May 2, 11:51 pm, Trevor Smithson
> > > <trevor_smith... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Fri, 02 May 2008 23:18:06 +0100, Mark Johnson
>
> > > > > 2. The already large install base would be a little
> > > > > pissed if future games were release on Blu-ray only.
>
> > > > If this happens it's very, very likely the addon will
> > > > be for movies only. There's no way they'd split the
> > > > userbase so late in the game.
>
> > > The rumor isn't that there's going to be an add-on; the
> > > rumor is that there will be Xbox 360 consoles with
> > > Blu-Ray drives built into them.
>
> > > If this is true and it's not to allow developers to use
> > > Blu-Ray as the game storage format, why on Earth would
> > > they bother with internal Blu- Ray drives?
>
> > It would be up to each individual developer, not MS.

Would any developer want to exclude the almost 20 million existing
console owners? More importantly, would the publishers ALLOW the
developers to exclude them? It's the publishers that have final say on
this.

Then... would MS bother investing money in such a project if most
publishers are just going to stick with DVD-9 anyway?

> > I don't see developers releasing games in BR only disks
> > until the new 360 has at least as many units sold as the
> > current version.
>
> I'd have thought it was probably a little late in the console's life span to
> switch media now.

A *little* late? LOL

> If cost wasn't a big issue (i.e. MS release external BR
> drives for about £35) then I could see it happening. AS it is. *If* an
> external drive was released it's probably cost in excess of £100. I think a
> more likely case will be that we start seeing more games released on
> multiple DVDs like Lost Odyssey was. Then BR being used for the next
> generation of MS console.

I wholeheartedly agree with you here.

> BTW does anyone know when we are expecting the next gen to come on the
> market?

Signs seem to be pointing to end of 2010 but nothing has been
officially announced or even solidly rumored.
 >> Stay informed about: Xbox 360 Blu-ray console shipping Q3.