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World Cup of VTES

 
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librarian

External


Since: Apr 12, 2006
Posts: 15



(Msg. 1) Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:42 am
Post subject: World Cup of VTES
Archived from groups: rec>games>trading-cards>jyhad (more info?)

So I am watching this little tournament they have every four years in
different places. Right now it's in Germany. Argentina looks strong,
but anyway...

It might be fun to do something like that for VTES.

I think it would be cool to do it like the Continental Championships,
but there would only be one representative from each country, and that
person would be flown to the venue by White Wolf, with their expenses
paid for by themselves, or if they can get a sponsor (?!). Perhaps the
first one would be in Atlanta GA.

These would be the winners of specific tournaments leading up to the
event, or perhaps the winners of the national championships.

What this would also mean is that nations with large VTES populations
(like the US), would only have one representative, as would nations
with small VTES populations (Japan, Lexembourg, etc). Just like in
football, Trinidad & Tobago only sends one team, as does England (even
though there are some hundreds if not thousands of professional teams
in England).

The events would perhaps be 3 rounds of "pool" play on the first day.
No player will play at a table with the same other player. Let's say
there are 30 players on day one. 15 advance to day two.

The top half of the players in "pool play" would advance to a round of
limited play (15 players). There would then be a draft (the next day?)
that would be 2 rounds worth. Top 5 finishers in the draft event play
in a final round of constructed death to declare the winner of the
World Cup of VTES.

A slightly different tournament from the Continentals, and it could be
held every 3rd year or so... And it might not be able to be called the
World Cup, I'm not sure if FIFA owns a trademark or not. Isn't there a
Rugby Union World Cup too?

best -

chris

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jeffkuta

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Since: Feb 08, 2005
Posts: 143



(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 10:31 am
Post subject: Re: World Cup of VTES [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

librarian wrote:
> So I am watching this little tournament they have every four years in
> different places. Right now it's in Germany. Argentina looks strong,
> but anyway...
>
> It might be fun to do something like that for VTES.

Here's how I'd do it:

Each team (country) has exactly five representatives, minimum of five
teams. I believe it is mathematically possible with 25+ people that in
a three-round tournament, you will never face the same person twice
with the additional restriction that you will face none of the your
four teammates either.

So, seed the tournament appropriately and run it for three rounds,
sorting the results by Game Wins, Victory Points, and Tournament
Points. And to top it all off, run one final round of play for *ALL*
competitors, but this round is for points. There are plenty of ways to
determine how much first is worth relative to second, etc based on the
total number of entrants.

What I mean is this, if you are in the top 5, you are at the final
table and get a guaranteed 5th place finish worth of points for your
team/country. If you finish the first round 6th-10th, you get minimum
10th place points for your team/country. After the fourth and final
round, add up all the points for each team member and that team wins
the event!

Jeff

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Omael

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Since: Feb 12, 2005
Posts: 81



(Msg. 3) Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:05 pm
Post subject: Re: World Cup of VTES [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Jozxyqk has made some rules for Sect Wars, maybe you should ask him, it
seemed like a fun event.
jeffkuta DeleteThis @pacbell.net wrote:
> librarian wrote:
> > So I am watching this little tournament they have every four years in
> > different places. Right now it's in Germany. Argentina looks strong,
> > but anyway...
> >
> > It might be fun to do something like that for VTES.
>
> Here's how I'd do it:
>
> Each team (country) has exactly five representatives, minimum of five
> teams. I believe it is mathematically possible with 25+ people that in
> a three-round tournament, you will never face the same person twice
> with the additional restriction that you will face none of the your
> four teammates either.
>
> So, seed the tournament appropriately and run it for three rounds,
> sorting the results by Game Wins, Victory Points, and Tournament
> Points. And to top it all off, run one final round of play for *ALL*
> competitors, but this round is for points. There are plenty of ways to
> determine how much first is worth relative to second, etc based on the
> total number of entrants.
>
> What I mean is this, if you are in the top 5, you are at the final
> table and get a guaranteed 5th place finish worth of points for your
> team/country. If you finish the first round 6th-10th, you get minimum
> 10th place points for your team/country. After the fourth and final
> round, add up all the points for each team member and that team wins
> the event!
>
> Jeff
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OrgPlay

External


Since: May 24, 2005
Posts: 69



(Msg. 4) Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:14 pm
Post subject: Re: World Cup of VTES [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

librarian wrote:
> So I am watching this little tournament they have every four years in
> different places. Right now it's in Germany. Argentina looks strong,
> but anyway...
>
> It might be fun to do something like that for VTES.
>
> I think it would be cool to do it like the Continental Championships,
> but there would only be one representative from each country, and that
> person would be flown to the venue by White Wolf, with their expenses
> paid for by themselves, or if they can get a sponsor (?!). Perhaps the
> first one would be in Atlanta GA.
>

If we did do such a thing, i'm pretty sure it would be called the Super
Bowl of VTES or maybe even the World Series of VTES.

Wink

oscar
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XZealot

External


Since: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 319



(Msg. 5) Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 4:09 pm
Post subject: Re: World Cup of VTES [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

OrgPlay wrote:
> librarian wrote:
> > So I am watching this little tournament they have every four years in
> > different places. Right now it's in Germany. Argentina looks strong,
> > but anyway...
> >
> > It might be fun to do something like that for VTES.
> >
> > I think it would be cool to do it like the Continental Championships,
> > but there would only be one representative from each country, and that
> > person would be flown to the venue by White Wolf, with their expenses
> > paid for by themselves, or if they can get a sponsor (?!). Perhaps the
> > first one would be in Atlanta GA.
> >
>
> If we did do such a thing, i'm pretty sure it would be called the Super
> Bowl of VTES or maybe even the World Series of VTES.

Vive Uber Cup del Mundo?

Comments Welcome,
Norman S. Brown, Jr
XZealot
Archon of the Swamp
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Slytherin

External


Since: Feb 15, 2005
Posts: 22



(Msg. 6) Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 10:48 pm
Post subject: Re: World Cup of VTES [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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librarian wrote:
<snip>

Sounds like it could be good fun. Would you propose limiting the
qualifiers to a tournament that cannot have anyone turn up from another
country (i.e. a Frenchman cannot qualify in UK - could be done as top 5
UK players qualify)

>
> A slightly different tournament from the Continentals, and it could be
> held every 3rd year or so... And it might not be able to be called the
> World Cup, I'm not sure if FIFA owns a trademark or not. Isn't there a
> Rugby Union World Cup too?
>
> best -
>
> chris

"World Cup" isn't trademarked, as there are a number of these now. The
one running currenty is the "FIFA World Cup" and must be called as such
within 50 metres of a stadium showing a match.

I think the Rugby Union World Cup has (c)'d Rugby World Cup (denying
League to do this) but I am not sure.

So, we could have a World Cup of VTES. Could be very exciting.

Looking forward to the podcast highlights Smile

Andy
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Johan Wester

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Since: Jun 21, 2006
Posts: 6



(Msg. 7) Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 9:32 am
Post subject: Re: World Cup of VTES [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Is it just me or would it or would the self-evident qualifying event for a
player be his or her (home) continental championship? To go back to the
countries themselves seems a bit backward to me.

Cyrus


"Slytherin" <andyb.TakeThisOut@operamail.com> skrev i meddelandet
news:1150868922.408635.63570@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
> librarian wrote:
> <snip>
>
> Sounds like it could be good fun. Would you propose limiting the
> qualifiers to a tournament that cannot have anyone turn up from another
> country (i.e. a Frenchman cannot qualify in UK - could be done as top 5
> UK players qualify)
>
>>
>> A slightly different tournament from the Continentals, and it could be
>> held every 3rd year or so... And it might not be able to be called the
>> World Cup, I'm not sure if FIFA owns a trademark or not. Isn't there a
>> Rugby Union World Cup too?
>>
>> best -
>>
>> chris
>
> "World Cup" isn't trademarked, as there are a number of these now. The
> one running currenty is the "FIFA World Cup" and must be called as such
> within 50 metres of a stadium showing a match.
>
> I think the Rugby Union World Cup has (c)'d Rugby World Cup (denying
> League to do this) but I am not sure.
>
> So, we could have a World Cup of VTES. Could be very exciting.
>
> Looking forward to the podcast highlights Smile
>
> Andy
>
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Huruem

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Since: Feb 28, 2006
Posts: 21



(Msg. 8) Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 11:39 am
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I definetly think that would be a great Idea, but I also know that I
wouldn't be able to pay the trip for such a tourney, let's say, in
America. Think that some of the players are penniless students as I am
!

Secondly I think that should be a regular tournament, or a 2 days
tourney, with on the first a limited one and a regular one the second
day as it's been done very cleverly in other CCGs. After that, you
could make a sort of classification of the countries by calculating the
results of the players by their origins.

Thirdly, there is still the problem of the qualification system. And I
think It should be quite similar to the system applied for the European
championship, which is quite fair I think.

Anyway, If White Wolf finds a solution to these problems, that would be
great. Damn ! i'd love to go to Atlanta !
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librarian

External


Since: Apr 12, 2006
Posts: 15



(Msg. 9) Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:17 pm
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Johan Wester wrote:
> Is it just me or would it or would the self-evident qualifying event for a
> player be his or her (home) continental championship? To go back to the
> countries themselves seems a bit backward to me.
>
>

Well, the continental champs will feature folks from the same country.
My idea is to get a little national fervor going behind the players
from each nation. If you just took the continental championships top
10 for instance, some of them might be from the same nation, and other
nations might have no one in the top 10.

Jeff Kuta's idea of five from each nation going is interesting, so that
it's sort of a team. But there would be money issues.



best -

chris
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librarian

External


Since: Apr 12, 2006
Posts: 15



(Msg. 10) Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:28 pm
Post subject: Re: World Cup of VTES [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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jeffkuta.TakeThisOut@pacbell.net wrote:
> librarian wrote:
> > So I am watching this little tournament they have every four years in
> > different places. Right now it's in Germany. Argentina looks strong,
> > but anyway...
> >
> > It might be fun to do something like that for VTES.
>
> Here's how I'd do it:
>
> Each team (country) has exactly five representatives, minimum of five
> teams. I believe it is mathematically possible with 25+ people that in
> a three-round tournament, you will never face the same person twice
> with the additional restriction that you will face none of the your
> four teammates either.

As long as the players NEVER faced each other in any rounds, this would
be cool. I just wouldn't want any collusion going on. The downside is
that money would be a big issue. I was hoping that if the tournament
was only once every 3 years, WW and perhaps some sponsors could sock
away money and fly those folks in. I would imagine that there are only
30~ nations playing Vtes right now.

(US, Canada, Mexico, Brazil, Aregentina?, Australia, New Zealand,
England, France, Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Netherlands, Denmark,
Sweden, Norway, Finland, Germany, Austria, Luxemburg?, Italy, Greece,
Poland, Czech, Slovakia, Poland, Phillipines, Ireland, Iceland,
Switzerland, Hungary, don't know about former Yugoslavian or Soviet
nations...)

Thirty people, WW might be able to swing; 150 people is a challenge.

>
> So, seed the tournament appropriately and run it for three rounds,
> sorting the results by Game Wins, Victory Points, and Tournament
> Points. And to top it all off, run one final round of play for *ALL*
> competitors, but this round is for points. There are plenty of ways to
> determine how much first is worth relative to second, etc based on the
> total number of entrants.
>
> What I mean is this, if you are in the top 5, you are at the final
> table and get a guaranteed 5th place finish worth of points for your
> team/country. If you finish the first round 6th-10th, you get minimum
> 10th place points for your team/country. After the fourth and final
> round, add up all the points for each team member and that team wins
> the event!


I don't understand this completely, but it seems like it could work.

best -

chris
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librarian

External


Since: Apr 12, 2006
Posts: 15



(Msg. 11) Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:46 pm
Post subject: Re: World Cup of VTES [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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firstconformist DeleteThis @aol.com wrote:
> >
>
> Besides, I really think that each kind of constructed event and each
> kind of limited V:TES event is a different game. So no matter the
> similarities, different people are better at each.


This is certainly an argument against mixing formats. In rugby, they
don't make teams run a full 15 game one week and then switch to a 7's
the next week - while the rules are very similar, and they look sort of
the same, they are very different.

I just have a special place in my heart for limited play. And around
here, the better limited players (Dennis Lien), also tend to be very
good constructed players as well. Limited does require a different
skill set. But that doesn't mean it can't be incorporated into a
tournament.

Finally, on your point (which I have unfortunately deleted already)
that you wouldn't pay to attend a tournament that feature limited - I
am proposing that WW pay for your air fare, you just pay for hotel and
amenities (or perhaps the reverse), and for an event as high profile as
a World Cup, of course all product would be paid for.

best -

chris
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Fabio 'Sooner' Macedo

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Since: Sep 09, 2005
Posts: 181



(Msg. 12) Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2006 9:45 am
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librarian wrote:
> Johan Wester wrote:
> > Is it just me or would it or would the self-evident qualifying event for a
> > player be his or her (home) continental championship? To go back to the
> > countries themselves seems a bit backward to me.
>
> Well, the continental champs will feature folks from the same country.
> My idea is to get a little national fervor going behind the players
> from each nation. If you just took the continental championships top
> 10 for instance, some of them might be from the same nation, and other
> nations might have no one in the top 10.

Yeah, I agree with this. Other than that, a good number of those 30
nations mentioned above do have national championships. Some are
qualifiers to the Continentals already, but so what? Only the champion
would get the spot to the World Cup of V:tES anyway.

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
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firstconformist

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Since: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 77



(Msg. 13) Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2006 4:14 pm
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> Finally, on your point (which I have unfortunately deleted already)
> that you wouldn't pay to attend a tournament that feature limited - I
> am proposing that WW pay for your air fare, you just pay for hotel and
> amenities (or perhaps the reverse), and for an event as high profile as
> a World Cup, of course all product would be paid for.

Oh -- I didn't mean for it to be taken as "the money is the problem".

I meant that I'd rather have a Constructed V:TES tournament than a
large pile of money, but I don't feel the same way about Limited.

In other words, the comparison was to show that I really truly love
competitive constructed play, but only kind of like Limited. I play in
Limited instead of Constructed sometimes, when both are going on--but
only when I'm getting enough Constructed already. I feel it's
enjoyable, and I do value the skills I get from engaging in it. I feel
exactly the same way about limited M:TG play. However, I wouldn't
choose M:TG limited play over any V:TES format, and I especially
wouldn't like M:TG limited being intermingled with V:TES play in any
way, because they are different games, and I'd like to be judged in
each one of them independently of my skill (or lack thereof, depending)
in the other.

My wish about not intermingling the different games M:TG and V:TES
parallels exactly my feelings about not intermingling limited and
constructed V:TES, it's just easier for people to understand that
position.

-- Brian
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Matthew T. Morgan

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Since: Feb 01, 2005
Posts: 173



(Msg. 14) Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2006 8:50 am
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On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 firstconformist.DeleteThis@aol.com wrote:

> My wish about not intermingling the different games M:TG and V:TES
> parallels exactly my feelings about not intermingling limited and
> constructed V:TES, it's just easier for people to understand that
> position.

Then I'm sure you'll be the first in line to join my movement to eliminate
constructed play entirely. I agree with you: it just gets in the way of
limited play.

Sign up now!

Matt Morgan
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