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Since: Aug 21, 2004 Posts: 1923
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 4:55 am
Post subject: UMD worth it for a wizard? Archived from groups: rec>games>frp>dnd (more info?)
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I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
--
Jasin Zujovic >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Jun 06, 2004 Posts: 460
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 6:21 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Jasin Zujovic wrote:
>I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
>obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
>
>But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
>spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
>Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
>enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
>required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
>
>
>
>
I think it might be worth it. Having the ability to essentially pick
up any spellcaster specific item off of the ground and use it could be
very handy.
Here's another idea: Use Psionic Device. If the game uses the
transparency rule you might convince a GM that UMD and UPD should apply
equally top both magical and psionic devices. Now THAT would be useful...
--
Tetsubo
My page: http://home.comcast.net/~tetsubo/
--------------------------------------
"The apparent lesson of the Inquisition is that insistence on uniformity of belief is fatal to intellectual, moral and spiritual health."
-The Uses Of The Past-, Herbert J. Muller
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <)
/_|_\ >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Aug 21, 2004 Posts: 1923
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 7:55 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <Xu6dnXrxlsTFNkDZnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d.TakeThisOut@comcast.com>,
tetsubo.TakeThisOut@comcast.net says...
> >I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
> >obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
> >
> >But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
> >spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
> >Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
> >enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
> >required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
>
> I think it might be worth it. Having the ability to essentially pick
> up any spellcaster specific item off of the ground and use it could be
> very handy.
Well, it's just cool to be able to do *anything*, but in terms of cost-
efficiency, I keep thinking it'd be simpler to just give the item to the
cleric to use.
The only thing that keeps crossing my mind is scrolls or wands of divine
power. Mmm... fighter BAB and CL 19th goodness!
> Here's another idea: Use Psionic Device. If the game uses the
> transparency rule you might convince a GM that UMD and UPD should apply
> equally top both magical and psionic devices. Now THAT would be useful...
I thought that was supposed to be the standard interpretation...?
It's not likely to come up in this game anyway, since no-one is playing
a psionic, and I think there aren't any in the adventures themselves.
--
Jasin Zujovic >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: May 03, 2005 Posts: 395
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 8:55 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Jasin Zujovic wrote:
> I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
> obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
>
> But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
> spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
> Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
> enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
> required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
What other skills is it that you want? Any well-designed Human Wizard
gets an absolute minimum of 5 skill points per level.
There's Spellcraft and Knowledge: Arcane as the two obvious choices, but
I can't see any skills, beyond those two, that look like must-haves for
Wizards.
--
Peter Knutsen
sagatafl.org >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Aug 21, 2004 Posts: 1923
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 8:55 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <44ddbaf3$0$146$157c6196@dreader1.cybercity.dk>,
peter.DeleteThis@sagatafl.invalid says...
> > I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
> > obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
> >
> > But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
> > spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
> > Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
> > enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
> > required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
>
> What other skills is it that you want? Any well-designed Human Wizard
> gets an absolute minimum of 5 skill points per level.
>
> There's Spellcraft and Knowledge: Arcane as the two obvious choices, but
> I can't see any skills, beyond those two, that look like must-haves for
> Wizards.
Search, other knowledges, diplomacy, skills that give synergy bonuses to
diplomacy... they're not must haves for a wizard, but they'd be useful
for the party, and they're the reason I'd be taking human paragon
levels, and if I'm sacrificing as level of spellcasting for skills, I'm
damn well making the most out of them!
--
Jasin Zujovic >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Nov 06, 2005 Posts: 70
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 10:55 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:08:39 +0200, Jasin Zujovic <jzujovic DeleteThis @inet.hr>
wrote:
>I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
>obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
>
>But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
>spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
>Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
>enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
>required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
The ability to use Cure Light Wounds wands isn't to be sneezed at...
--
"Hope is replaced by fear and dreams by survival, most of us get by."
Stuart Adamson 1958-2001
Mad Hamish
Hamish Laws
newsunspammelaws DeleteThis @iinet.unspamme.net.au >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Feb 25, 2005 Posts: 484
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:38 pm
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Jasin Zujovic wrote:
> I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
> obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
>
> But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
> spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
> Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
> enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
> required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
>
>
> --
> Jasin Zujovic
If you specialize, you could use Use Magic Device for scrolls, wands,
and staves of spells from your opposition schools.
Gerald Katz >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: May 20, 2006 Posts: 203
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 3:55 pm
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Peter Knutsen (usenet) wrote:
> Jasin Zujovic wrote:
>> I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of
>> the obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
>>
>> But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
>> spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the
>> game. Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun,
>> but fun enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're
>> almost required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using
>> scrolls)?
>
> What other skills is it that you want? Any well-designed Human Wizard
> gets an absolute minimum of 5 skill points per level.
>
> There's Spellcraft and Knowledge: Arcane as the two obvious choices,
> but I can't see any skills, beyond those two, that look like
> must-haves for Wizards.
Concentration is more-or-less a must-have for any primary spellcaster.
--
Mark. >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: May 03, 2005 Posts: 395
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2006 3:55 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Mark Blunden wrote:
> Peter Knutsen (usenet) wrote:
>>What other skills is it that you want? Any well-designed Human Wizard
>>gets an absolute minimum of 5 skill points per level.
>>
>>There's Spellcraft and Knowledge: Arcane as the two obvious choices,
>>but I can't see any skills, beyond those two, that look like
>>must-haves for Wizards.
>
> Concentration is more-or-less a must-have for any primary spellcaster.
Yes, I've overlooked that one.
--
Peter Knutsen
sagatafl.org >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Mar 17, 2005 Posts: 11
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2006 1:55 pm
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <44ddbaf3$0$146$157c6196@dreader1.cybercity.dk>,
Peter Knutsen (usenet) <peter DeleteThis @sagatafl.invalid> wrote:
>Jasin Zujovic wrote:
>> I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
>> obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
>>
>> But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
>> spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
>> Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
>> enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
>> required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
>
>What other skills is it that you want? Any well-designed Human Wizard
>gets an absolute minimum of 5 skill points per level.
>
>There's Spellcraft and Knowledge: Arcane as the two obvious choices, but
>I can't see any skills, beyond those two, that look like must-haves for
>Wizards.
Concentration, unless your enemies are always polite enough to never
interrupt your casting.
Tony Z
--
If you don't have time for frivolities, you aren't doing it right.
--Annie Jason Masmajean (Janet Kagan, _Mirabile_) >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Dec 16, 2004 Posts: 142
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 9:39 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Jasin Zujovic" <jzujovic.DeleteThis@inet.hr> wrote in message
news:MPG.1f47a98252af82bb989b9b@news.iskon.hr...
> I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
> obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
>
> But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
> spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
> Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
> enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
> required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
One aspect I haven't seen mentioned is UMD with crafting wizards. Being
able to craft a divine wand for use by the party cleric by using divine
scrolls via UMD might be useful if you want to avoid multi-classing.
David >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Jul 19, 2005 Posts: 374
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 9:45 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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David wrote:
> "Jasin Zujovic" <jzujovic RemoveThis @inet.hr> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1f47a98252af82bb989b9b@news.iskon.hr...
> > I'm thinking of making a wizard/human paragon, and of course one of the
> > obvious class skills to pick is UMD.
> >
> > But is it really all that useful for someone with a wizardly
> > spellcasting? Ostensibly, those are already the best spells in the game.
> > Being able to dabble in cleric or druid spells could be fun, but fun
> > enough to sacrifice another skill at max ranks (since you're almost
> > required to keep UMD at max ranks if you want to be using scrolls)?
>
> One aspect I haven't seen mentioned is UMD with crafting wizards. Being
> able to craft a divine wand for use by the party cleric by using divine
> scrolls via UMD might be useful if you want to avoid multi-classing.
Or you could just have the cleric provide the spells to make the wand,
as is explicitely and clearly allowed in the rules.
DougL >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Dec 16, 2004 Posts: 142
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 9:52 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"DougL" <lampert.doug.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1155660333.167490.34780@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
> David wrote:
>> One aspect I haven't seen mentioned is UMD with crafting wizards. Being
>> able to craft a divine wand for use by the party cleric by using divine
>> scrolls via UMD might be useful if you want to avoid multi-classing.
>
> Or you could just have the cleric provide the spells to make the wand,
> as is explicitely and clearly allowed in the rules.
Ah, I play almost exclusively in LG, where cooperative crafting is
explicitly prohibitted.
Thx for the info.
David >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Aug 21, 2004 Posts: 1923
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 6:55 pm
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I've thought of a good reason for getting UMD.
"For each skill in which either the master or the familiar has ranks,
use either the normal skill ranks for an animal of that type or the
master’s skill ranks, whichever are better."
--
Jasin Zujovic >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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Since: Jun 08, 2005 Posts: 1864
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 9:23 am
Post subject: Re: UMD worth it for a wizard? [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Jasin Zujovic wrote:
> I've thought of a good reason for getting UMD.
>
> "For each skill in which either the master or the familiar has ranks,
> use either the normal skill ranks for an animal of that type or the
> master's skill ranks, whichever are better."
>
Ooh, damn. That's hella nasty, if your familiar can cast something
from a wand or scrolls... That's almost as good as a free quicken
spell. Although how they are holding it, or talking might be a
problem. Although crow familiars can talk. Gives new reason to take
improved familiar and get a homonculous or something else that has arms
and can talk.
- Justisaur >> Stay informed about: UMD worth it for a wizard? |
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