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The Rev

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Since: Nov 15, 2004
Posts: 1435



(Msg. 1) Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:51 am
Post subject: Top Ten Best Games Ever
Archived from groups: uk>games>video>misc (more info?)

It's January, so it's time to update my Best Games Ever Top Ten list.
Because I'm a giant geek. This is just a blog repost (boo!), but after the
year we've just had I'm interested to see if anyone else feels like making a
list and seeing how much of 2007 finds its way in. I think everyone agrees
that it's been a great year overall, but has it been full of classic,
best-ever games for you, or just very enjoyable ones that were fun but can
now be forgotten? There's one game that's stood as game of the year for most
people who have played it, but where does it figure in the best games ever?
Is it too soon to judge?

I dunno, I just think it's interesting. Feel free to ignore me.

It's been very tough for me this year, with five (!) new entries meaning
that some old favourites have had to be dropped. Dragon Quest VIII was quite
an easy one to lose, Super Mario 64 was easily replaced by Super Mario
Galaxy, but I was loathe to cut GTA: San Andreas, World of Warcraft and
OutRun 2006. And I'd have liked to add Rush'n Attack, Bioshock, Resistance:
Fall of Man, Peggle Deluxe and many others as new entries if I had the
space. (Resident Evil 4 nearly made a comeback, too.) Unfortunately, though,
this has been an exceptional year for gaming and after much hair-pulling and
hand-wringing I've settled on the top ten below.

Please note that the list is based on love, rather than technical expertise,
importance or any of that other guff. The list below is games that, for
whatever reason, I just fell in love with and which I'd love to play today.
It's not a list of "desert island" games - if I was going to be trapped for
a long time I'd probably take Civilization 4 over Portal, for example, and
would probably want World of Warcraft in there - but all these games I
genuinely love.

It's my favourite games. It's completely subjective. But that's kind of the
point and I think it's the only way you can honestly and realistically talk
about the games being the "best".

10. (NE) Portal (360)

Can a game really be one of the ten best games ever when it's only three
hours long? When it's as good as Portal, yes. It's got the best script ever
- in a moment of madness shortly after completing the game I even toyed with
getting "The cake is a lie" tattooed on my person - it's got great puzzles
and it's just about the best single evening of gaming I've ever had.
Funniest game ever, also. And the it's got the best song in any game, ever,
too. Genius.

9. (6) Animal Crossing: Wild World (DS)

It feels odd putting this in a list of the best games, because it doesn't
feel like a game. It feels like a place. I didn't so much play Animal
Crossing as live in Venture (my town) and Vatican (my wife's town) for a
year or so. It has special significance for me, because before I married my
wife we were in a long distance relationship and we used Animal Crossing to
reduce that distance. We'd sit on the phone talking, with a DS each,
visiting each other, fishing, giving presents, getting to know the animal
residents and sometimes just sitting in my kitchen to have some tea
together. (And swearing when the connection died and we'd have to restart.)
That's why it's in my top ten.

8. (NE) Disgaea: Afternoon of Darkness (PSP)

The PS2 version has been hovering in or around my top ten since it came out.
The PSP version has pushed it over the edge. It's the same great game, but
there's even more of it and, most importantly, it's portable. When the
wife's watching TV, when I've got a spare few moments in the office at
lunchtime, when I plain just to want to play it, it's there. (As long as
I've remembered to charge the PSP. I've got pretty good at that now,
though.) It's sandbox strategy - and I do like my sandboxes. It's not about
the story, it's about the team. Creating your own team to your own
specifications. There's an attachment to the characters you create that's
unmatched in any game - and is slightly ridiculous given the fact that they
never speak or do anything but fight. Somehow, though, my Golem Franky has
become friends with my Prinnies. There's no in-game dialogue to that effect,
no cut scenes showing them together, but I just tend to use them together in
attacks and that's been translated in my head into an emotional bond between
them. Looking at this list, I think that if I could play any game right now,
it would be this one.

7. (NE) Halo 3 (360)

You're probably looking at this and thinking a couple of things. "This must
be a vote for the series, not the game." "This is in the top ten for the
multiplayer alone." Wrong on both counts. Halo was single-player heaven, but
I never got on with the multi-player side of things. Halo 2 twisted the
other way. I loved it online, but never finished the single player portion.
(I read the plot summary on Wikipedia when Halo 3 came out so I'd know what
was going on.) Halo 3 is the best of both worlds. The multiplayer is
exceptional. With a good group of friends it's the best shooter I've ever
played online. But it's the single player side that really surprised me, in
that I can get hopelessly stuck and spend days on a single checkpoint and
still love playing it. That's probably the reason it's here, more than the
co-op or the Theater or the new Forge-made games.

6. (2) Elder Scrolls: Oblivion (360/PC)

This has lost quite a few places since last year. Mainly because I feel like
I've exhausted it. I nearly even dropped it from the top ten. But then I
started thinking harder about it. About the memories. The Dark Brotherhood
missions. Finding ruins and sneaking through them to get lovely treasures.
The snow at night and bears on the road. Leaping over the rooftops. Stealing
from castles. Great moments, all of them. The trouble is that while I've
still got lots more to do - I've barely touched The Shivering Isles, I'm
half-way through the Mages Guild quests and haven't joined the Fighters
Guild - my character has peaked. It's been hours and hours since I found any
new kit that improves on what I've got and my most important skills are
close to being maxed out, if they're not already there. Oh, and recharging
and repairing all my magical items is a very annoying chore. That's why it's
not the second best game ever. The couple of hundred hours of glorious
gaming fun it gave me before I reached this point is the reason it's still
number six on the list. And it's been a long time since I last played, maybe
it'll feel fresh again. There's all that Shivering Isles stuff to do. And a
ghost on the shore I never did go to see. And maybe I should work out what
spells I need to shoot at the pillars in those underground ruins to advance
through the Mages Guild. And I'm handy with a sword now, maybe the Fighters
Guild could do with my skills...

5. (NE) Crackdown (360)

I wasn't expecting this. Like many others, I bought Crackdown because I
hoped it would be good, but also because I wanted to play the Halo 3 beta. I
was hoping for a fun game that would be worth the cash. What I got was one
of the greatest games of all time. I love my sandboxes, as I think I've
mentioned. That's pretty much all Crackdown is. Story is kept to an absolute
minimum, freedom reigns. Good, good, good. The main pleasure is the jumping,
obviously, but that's not to say there's anything wrong with the rest of it.
It's just an absolute joy to play. Jumping, running, driving, shooting,
kicking... don't forget the kicking. And don't forget the Agency Tower.
Virtual vertigo never felt so real. Oh, and to cap it all, the phrase "Good
work agent" has entered the everyday vocabulary of my household. The
announcer is wonderful, despite claiming to be able to see his house when
I'm in a tunnel somewhere.

4. (7) Mr Driller: Drill Spirits (DS)

The best Mr Driller game there is. If you're an English speaker and you like
handheld games. Which I am and I do. I can always go back to this and have
fun. Tetris I've tired of, but Mr Driller keeps on giving. Great music and
sound effects, but perfectly playable in silence - as all the best handheld
games are. Where's the sequel, Mister Namco?

3. (5) Ico (PS2)

I told you this top ten list was all about love. My love for this game keeps
growing, even though I've not played it for a long, long time. I probably
should. I should check that the puzzles are still head-scratching fun. I
should check that the combat isn't as annoying as many people say it is. I
should check that it still looks gorgeous. I should check that the
relationship between Ico and Yorda still tugs my heartstrings in all the
right ways... Or maybe I shouldn't. Maybe it should just be left to
memories, like so much of life and love.

2. (NE) Super Mario Galaxy (Wii)

Do I really need to explain why this is here? Surely everybody has played it
by now? Surely everybody loves it into tiny little pieces? Well, no and no.
There are people without Wiis. There are Internet grumblers. There are
people who this just hasn't clicked with, through no fault of their own and
no fault of the game. I'll just say that played in co-op with my wife this
is gaming perfection. It's just right. It's honed and polished and it's big
and bright and colourful and fun and - I'm going to have to use the j-word
again, but this time in caps - it's pure JOY. And then, after sixty-odd
stars, it starts getting difficult and the JOY fades somewhat, but that
gaming determination, that feeling of "I will beat this level if it kills
me", grows and grows and the experience is completely different, but still
brilliant and Nintendo have finally done it. Mario 64, your time is up. Go
home, old man. Get some rest. Super Mario Galaxy is here now. And I don't
think it's going anywhere.

1. (1) Doom (PC/360)

I give up. Every year I wait for the Doom-beater. It never comes. This is
the best game ever. It has been since it was released and it doesn't look
like shifting from the top spot any time soon. No game feels like Doom, you
see. The speed is just right and the responsiveness of all the controls are
perfect. Much to my own frustration I can't explain what I mean by "feel",
but it's just magic. (Resistance: Fall of Man feels very similar, which is
why I think I liked it so much.) We've got a special understanding, I think.
There's no barrier between us. Sure, I'm still rubbish at it. I die a lot.
Over and over again. But so what? It's a tough world out there. And the
shotgun still hasn't been bettered. (Though Painkiller's stake gun came close.)

For reference, previous top tens of mine -

2007

10. (NE) Dragon Quest VIII (PS2)
9. (NE) OutRun 2006: Coast 2 Coast (XBOX/PSP)
8. (7) World of Warcraft (PC)
7. (9) Mr Driller: Drill Spirits (DS)
6. (10) Animal Crossing: Wild World (DS)
5. (6) ICO (PS2)
4. (3) GTA: San Andreas (PS2)
3. (4) Mario 64 (N64)
2. (NE) Elder Scrolls: Oblivion (360/PC)
1. (1) Doom (PC/360)

2006

10. (NE) Animal Crossing: Wild World (DS)
9. (6) Mr Driller: Drill Spirits (DS)
8. (10) Resident Evil 4 (GC)
7. (NE) World of Warcraft (PC)
6. (5) ICO (PS2)
5. (7) OutRun 2 (XBOX)
4. (2) Mario 64 (N64)
3. (Cool GTA: San Andreas (PS2)
2. (3) Elder Scrolls: Morrowind GOTY (PC)
1. (1) Doom (PC)

2005

10. (NE) Resident Evil 4 (GC)
9. (5) Giga Wing (DC/PC/MAC)
8. (NE) GTA: San Andreas (PS2)
7. (NE) OutRun 2 (Xbox)
6. (NE) Mr Driller Drill Spirits (DS)
5. (4) ICO (PS2)
4. (NE) Disgaea (PS2)
3. (NE) Morrowind: GOTY (PC/Xbox)
2. (3) Mario 64 (N64/DS)
1. (1) Doom (PC)

2004

10. Advance Wars 2 (GBA)
9. Rez (Playstation 2)
8. Halo (Xbox)
7. Castlevania: Symphony Of The Night (Playstation)
6. Super Monkey Ball (Gamecube)
5. Giga Wing (Dreamcast)
4. ICO (Playstation 2)
3. Mario 64 (Nintendo 64)
2. Grand Theft Auto 3 (Playstation 2)
1. Doom (PC)

Seems I didn't do one in 2003, but in 2002 I did. Only two of those are in
the top ten now.

2002

10. Sam & Max
9. Lode Runner
8. Suikoden 2
7. Rollercoaster Tycoon
6. Giga Wing
5. Rez
4. ICO
3. Mario 64
2. GTA3
1. Doom

You just scrolled down to the bottom to see if anything was here, didn't you?

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Chris Stevens

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Since: Jan 26, 2005
Posts: 416



(Msg. 2) Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 1:36 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Best Games Ever [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"The Rev" <the_rev_yes_really.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5u1c58F1ftetaU1@mid.individual.net...
> It's January, so it's time to update my Best Games Ever Top Ten list.
> Because I'm a giant geek. This is just a blog repost (boo!), but after the
> year we've just had I'm interested to see if anyone else feels like making
> a list and seeing how much of 2007 finds its way in.

Y'know, I don't think I've ever attempted a top 10 games list before.
Seriously. Not even in my head. So, with minimal forethought, and even less
explanation, I'd put mine as something like...

10: Super Mario Sunshine (GC)
Controversial inclusion, perhaps. Especially as it's at the expense of SM64.
I just felt that it had more character, and loved just bouncing and jetting
around Delfino Plaza (and yes, I did like the FLUDD. So there).

9: Grand Theft Auto 3 (PC)
The release of this was the last time my PC was anywhere near state of the
art, and it was *because* of this that it was. Just like nothing else that
came before it in terms of scale and freedom.

8: Jet Set Radio (DC)
I'm not sure if there had been any cel-shaded games before this, but it was
certainly the first time I'd seen the effect, and it looked fantastic. It
also sort of helped that there was a fantastic game underneath the beautiful
looks.

7: Project Gotham Racing 2 (Xbox)
I loved MSR, and was mildly disappointed with the first PGR, but when this
came along, my socks were well and truly blown off. The variety of cars and
cities was second to none (and still hasn't been surpassed by the current
gen iterations), and most of all, the online play was beautifully
implemented and, frankly, just lots of fun.

6: Halo 2 (Xbox)
OK, the story was a let down and didn't really even have a proper ending,
but this qualifies purely on the merits of its multiplayer game. Some of the
small maps were truly excellent, and even though I was really pretty poor at
it, it didn't stop me pouring hours and hours of my life into getting
humiliated and abused by squeaky-voiced American teenagers.

5: Portal (360)
Short and sweet. Brilliantly inventive, and although the main game was
perhaps a little on the easy side (as well as short), this was made up for
by the challenges and advanced levels, which were the real meat of the game
for me.

4: Super Mario Galaxy (Wii)
Everything about it is good.The controls are beautiful, making clever use of
the Wiimote, without (like so many other Wii games) it ever feeling
contrived. It is certainly the best looking Wii game by a country mile, and
puts many of the titles on the HD machines to shame, and the sound
(including the gorgeous score) is stunning.

3: Links 2004 (Xbox)
I should qualify this by saying that the last two versions of Tiger Woods
are better golf games. BUT, in its time, this was the ultimate, and the XSN
integration was a large part of what really set it apart. I just wish that
there were a similar facility for 360 games, because it really brought some
meaning to online play. The fact that it really was 'one attempt' at any
tournament round was challenging and made for some unpredictable results at
times.

2: Rainbow Six 3:Black Arrow (Xbox)
Odd one this. On the surface, it was a cheaply put together add-on to the
original RS3, with a fairly short story mode and a handful of new
multiplayer maps. It was the quality of those maps, though, coupled with the
(at the time) superb game engine of the original that meant that this was
probably the most played game on my Xbox. Ferry remains the best deathmatch
map I've ever played on.

1: Halo 3 (360)
I'm sorry. Really I am. I *am* a bit of a Halo fanboy, and the fact that
this managed to improve on the multiplayer side of Halo 2, and provided a
campaign mode on a par with Halo means that I can't even consider anything
else above it.


I'm almost certain that I've made at least one glaring omission, but that's
the problem with lists like this - unless you spend days thinking about
them, they're inevitably limited by the contents of your short term memory.
I thus reserve the right to declare any other game not mentioned here as the
best game ever at some later date.


Chris.

GT: SomethingWitty

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The Rev

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Since: Nov 15, 2004
Posts: 1435



(Msg. 3) Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Best Games Ever [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Zomoniac wrote:
>
> 5. Gran Turismo 5 (PS3) - It's not out yet, but I've invented it in my
> head

Don't ever change, Zo.
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The Rev

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Since: Nov 15, 2004
Posts: 1435



(Msg. 4) Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:32 pm
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Chris Stevens wrote:
>
> 8: Jet Set Radio (DC)
> I'm not sure if there had been any cel-shaded games before this, but it was
> certainly the first time I'd seen the effect, and it looked fantastic. It
> also sort of helped that there was a fantastic game underneath the beautiful
> looks.

I think Wacky Races came out before it.

(And was, of course, the OFFICIAL Best Game Ever.)
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Sir Chewbury Gubbins

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Since: Oct 29, 2007
Posts: 259



(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:34 pm
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Zomoniac the Monkey was never naughty:
>
> 5. Gran Turismo 5 (PS3) - It's not out yet, but I've invented it in my
> head, built from the visuals, sounds, gameplay, cockpit view and
> interface from GT5P, and the depth and being-in-English from GT4.
> They've already built the ultimate driving game, spread over two games,
> it now just needs assembling.

.......and it's goign to be a Wii exclusive.


Choobs

--
Sir Chewbury Gubbins <choobs RemoveThis @chewbury.net.invalid>
... Blog : http://www.nelefa.org
/|\ Game Diary : http://www.chewbury.net
/ | \ Abu the Monkey was never naughty.
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[ste parker]

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Since: Oct 18, 2004
Posts: 1605



(Msg. 6) Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:36 pm
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The Rev wrote:
> Zomoniac wrote:
>>
>> 5. Gran Turismo 5 (PS3) - It's not out yet, but I've invented it in my
>> head
>
> Don't ever change, Zo.

Isn't it a bit odd that even in his imagination he can only come up with
the 5th best game ever? GT5 - aiming low!

--
[ste]
gamertag: stefcha
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Zomoniac

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Since: Dec 31, 2004
Posts: 1448



(Msg. 7) Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:42 pm
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Sir Chewbury Gubbins wrote:
> Zomoniac the Monkey was never naughty:
>> 5. Gran Turismo 5 (PS3) - It's not out yet, but I've invented it in my
>> head, built from the visuals, sounds, gameplay, cockpit view and
>> interface from GT5P, and the depth and being-in-English from GT4.
>> They've already built the ultimate driving game, spread over two games,
>> it now just needs assembling.
>
> ......and it's goign to be a Wii exclusive.

Only Cell and RSX can produce the level of emotion felt in these cars.
It'll never happen.

--

Zo
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Luke Curtis

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Since: Aug 06, 2007
Posts: 40



(Msg. 8) Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 9:25 pm
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On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 11:51:03 +0000, The Rev
<the_rev_yes_really RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote:

>It's January, so it's time to update my Best Games Ever Top Ten list.
>Because I'm a giant geek. This is just a blog repost (boo!), but after the
>year we've just had I'm interested to see if anyone else feels like making a
>list and seeing how much of 2007 finds its way in. I think everyone agrees
>that it's been a great year overall, but has it been full of classic,
>best-ever games for you, or just very enjoyable ones that were fun but can
>now be forgotten? There's one game that's stood as game of the year for most
>people who have played it, but where does it figure in the best games ever?
>Is it too soon to judge?
>
>I dunno, I just think it's interesting. Feel free to ignore me.
>
>It's been very tough for me this year, with five (!) new entries meaning
>that some old favourites have had to be dropped. Dragon Quest VIII was quite
>an easy one to lose, Super Mario 64 was easily replaced by Super Mario
>Galaxy, but I was loathe to cut GTA: San Andreas, World of Warcraft and
>OutRun 2006. And I'd have liked to add Rush'n Attack, Bioshock, Resistance:
>Fall of Man, Peggle Deluxe and many others as new entries if I had the
>space. (Resident Evil 4 nearly made a comeback, too.) Unfortunately, though,
>this has been an exceptional year for gaming and after much hair-pulling and
>hand-wringing I've settled on the top ten below.
>
>Please note that the list is based on love, rather than technical expertise,
>importance or any of that other guff. The list below is games that, for
>whatever reason, I just fell in love with and which I'd love to play today.
>It's not a list of "desert island" games - if I was going to be trapped for
>a long time I'd probably take Civilization 4 over Portal, for example, and
>would probably want World of Warcraft in there - but all these games I
>genuinely love.
><SNIP>

1) Dungeon Master (Amiga)
Any game that I can play 26 hours straight without a break has to be a
brilliant game and still just as enjoyable now.

2) Orange Box
*almost* overtook DM for no 1 spot with the addition of Portal and
episodes 1 & 2... (haven't played TF2 yet)

3) Civilization 2 (PC & Amiga)
Many, many hours spent playing this, so simple but so complex at the
same time.

4) Kick Off 2 (Amiga)
multi player heaven! (and miles better then sensible soccer)

5) Quake 2 (PC)
better than Doom despite the many posts on this thread, Doom 3 looked
great and may well have taken Q2s place but I never got it to run
smoothly on my system.

6) Battlefield 2 (PC)
displaces 1942, the same but more and better

Cool FA18: Interceptor (Amiga)
I sold my Atari ST and bought an Amiga A500 for this one game, no
other single game has ever made me go out and buy either a new console
or new hardware just to play it.

7) Populous (Amiga)
can't believe I missed this before, fantastic. Populous - The
Beginnings is excellent on the PC as well.

9) Unreal Tournament
More multi player brilliance, Face Off is a level of complete genius.
only stopped playing it because of LPBs - a common problem at the
time....

10) PGR2
best of the 4, just.



I suspect Call of Duty 4 will be in there in later years, but I
haven't finished it yet. Likewise I have only just started playing
Oblivion, it looks like finally a RPG which looks to be every bit as
engrossing as DM, Black Crypt being the previous closest.



and no none of the Halo games come even close to the list despite me
playing all 3 in depth.


Losing out this year:
Deus Ex: Was great but I really don't know why I put it in there,
great premise but I never went and replayed it to play the other
version of the game

Doom: mainly due to the release on Live, I just didn't enjoy it
anywhere near as much as previously, unlike DM which I played quite a
bit earlier in the year when my 360 died.


Soul Caliber 2
it just got far too difficult too quick

Burnout 3, lots of fun in the crash mode but the time trials are
frankly boring.

Far Cry: great game but there are plenty of FPS titles about which
come up to Far Cry's level (and the 360 version was comparatively
poor)


2006
1) Dungeon Master (Amiga)
2) Half Life 2 (PC)
3) Civilization 2 (PC & Amiga)
4) Deus Ex (PC)
5) Kick Off 2 (Amiga)
6) Doom (PC)
Cool Soul Caliber 2 (Xbox)
7) Quake 2 (PC)
9) Burnout 3 (Xbox)
10) Battlefield 1942 (PC)

as above plus
Project Gotham 2 & 3 (Xbox & 360)
Uridium (C64)
Carmageddon 2 (PC)


2005

1) Dungeon Master (Amiga)
2) Half Life 2 (PC)
3) Civilization 2 (PC & Amiga)
4) Deus Ex (PC)
5) Kick Off 2 (Amiga)
6) Doom (PC)
Cool Soul Caliber 2 (Xbox)
7) Far Cry (PC)
9) Burnout 3 (Xbox)
10) Battlefield 1942 (PC)

Honorable Mentions:

Burnout 3 (Xbox)
Quake (PC)
Knight Lore (Spectrum)
Tetris (Gameboy)
Archipelagos (Amiga)
Sentinel (Amiga)
Halo (XBox)
-

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--
ButIstillneedtoknowwhat'sinthere! Thekeytoanysecurity
systemishowit'sdesigned! Thatdependsonwhyitwasdesigned!
Ihavetoknowwhatwhoeverdesigneditwastryingtoprotect!
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deKay

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Since: Apr 24, 2004
Posts: 2122



(Msg. 9) Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 11:13 am
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Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Thu, 10 Jan
2008 11:58:03 -0000, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
uk.games.video.misc, yawatina tan reek esk "Chris Stevens"
<news.TakeThisOut@thestevensfamily.plus.com> fornis do marikano es bono tan el:

>I'm not going to try to elevate the story to the status of high art, but it
>served its purpose (providing dramatic tension and urgency where required).
>In terms of the actual *gameplay* of the campaign mode, I would respectfully
>suggest that you are wrong. In a way, it's a sucession of set-pieces, but
>the quality of the design of the environments, the enemy AI, and the
>multitude of different possible approaches to beating them is superb.
>What was your main complaint about it? I've heard the 'treacle' complaints,
>but I just don't see it myself.

Well, yes, it's slow. It's also been done to death already (I've had enough
of space marines). The enemy AI showed no sign of any "I" that I could see.
It just wasn't fun to play.

Admittedly, I haven't played the entire game, just the first two hours, an
hour or two in the middle, and the last chapter, but even if they were the
worst bits, that's still half of the game I didn't like. And the
driving-the-jeep thing bit at the end of the game was horrific.

>> To be honest, fun online as Halo 3 was, I had far more fun with LAN play
>> on
>> Duke Nukem 3D back in the day.
>
>Again, I respectfully suggest that you are mistaken. Wink
>You can't really judge the enduring quality of a multiplayer game from
>playing only a handful of games.

I've spent about 8 hours playing it online, and two hours playing it over a
LAN.

>H3 will continue to be fun for me (and many
>others) for a long time, even if only against randoms, simply because of the
>superb map design and weapon balance.

TF2 beats it into a cocked hat in terms of map design and weapon balance. In
fact, TF2 is the very definition of excellent map design and weapon balance.

In Halo 3, it seemed very much like whoever had certain weapons would win.
And whoever had the needle gun thing would lose.

>With decent players, there is no one
>weapon or spot on the map that gives anything other than a minor (and most
>often temporary) advantage. I agree that some of the more obscure game types
>are a little weak, but these days I primarily play Slayer/Team Slayer for my
>quick bursts and the occasional Team Objective type game when I've got a bit
>more time. I genuinely believe there isn't a better all-round multiplayer
>FPS at this moment in time. Oh, and Theatre and Forge (as a tool, as opposed
>to a game type) add even further to the enjoyment. Were you playing the week
>we did the 'Normandy Landings' type game on Last Resort? That's a fine
>example of a user-created variation, and shows the possibilities of Forge
>nicely.

I wasn't, no.

>> So basically, for single player, 99% of all FPS games > Halo 3, for
>> multiplayer, Something 13 Years Old > Halo 3.
>
>Yes. Of course. :p

It's true though. I'll admit, Halo 3 is a far better game than I was
expecting, but it's still only a 3/5 game for me.

deKay
--
Lofi Gaming - http://lofi-gaming.org.uk
Gaming Diary - http://lofi-gaming.org.uk/diary
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My computer runs at 3.5MHz and I'm proud of that
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deKay

External


Since: Apr 24, 2004
Posts: 2122



(Msg. 10) Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 11:13 am
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Best Games Ever [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Thu, 10 Jan
2008 14:00:01 +0000, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
uk.games.video.misc, yawatina tan reek esk Toby Newman <google.DeleteThis@asktoby.com>
fornis do marikano es bono tan el:

>> To be honest, fun online as Halo 3 was, I had far more fun with LAN play on
>> Duke Nukem 3D back in the day.
>
>Bring back holo-duke!

Remote detonation of pipe bombs (put them somewhere, then watch the location
from the CCTV monitor - BOOM!) and exploding trip wires FTW.

deKay
--
Lofi Gaming - http://lofi-gaming.org.uk
Gaming Diary - http://lofi-gaming.org.uk/diary
Blog - http://lofi-gaming.org.uk/blog
My computer runs at 3.5MHz and I'm proud of that
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Chris Stevens

External


Since: Jan 26, 2005
Posts: 416



(Msg. 11) Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 5:10 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Best Games Ever [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"deKay" <andyk.DeleteThis@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote in message
news:df6co317s0au96e36r9fn3unsjfsjn5j8o@4ax.com...
>>What was your main complaint about it? I've heard the 'treacle'
>>complaints,
>>but I just don't see it myself.
>
> Well, yes, it's slow. It's also been done to death already (I've had
> enough
> of space marines). The enemy AI showed no sign of any "I" that I could
> see.
> It just wasn't fun to play.
>
> Admittedly, I haven't played the entire game, just the first two hours, an
> hour or two in the middle, and the last chapter, but even if they were the
> worst bits, that's still half of the game I didn't like. And the
> driving-the-jeep thing bit at the end of the game was horrific.

In the context of the game (climactic finale), I thought the warthog section
was OK. I still think that you're being a little harsh in your judgement -
the campaign, really, is meant to be played through in order. You're not
allowing for any dramatic tension or continuity by playing random missions
out of order. I also suspect that if you weren't seeing a great deal of 'I'
from the AI, then you were playing it on Normal. It's a different game on
Legendary (and frankly too hard for me - I'm only through 2 of the chapters
at that level of difficulty so far).

>>> To be honest, fun online as Halo 3 was, I had far more fun with LAN play
>>> on
>>> Duke Nukem 3D back in the day.
>>
>>Again, I respectfully suggest that you are mistaken. Wink
>>You can't really judge the enduring quality of a multiplayer game from
>>playing only a handful of games.
>
> I've spent about 8 hours playing it online, and two hours playing it over
> a
> LAN.

8 hours? Are you sure? bungie.net suggests that you've played a total of 12
matches, which probably equates to less than 2 hours play.
I'm not trying to be dismissive, but I still think that you need to have
played it more to form a meaningful judgement. After 12 games, you'll still
not have seen all the maps, still not tried all the game types, still not
learnt which weapons are appropriate for a given situation, etc, etc.

>>H3 will continue to be fun for me (and many
>>others) for a long time, even if only against randoms, simply because of
>>the
>>superb map design and weapon balance.
>
> TF2 beats it into a cocked hat in terms of map design and weapon balance.
> In
> fact, TF2 is the very definition of excellent map design and weapon
> balance.

It's a bit different, though, isn't it? Your weapon choice is determined
solely by your character class. There's no scope for changing weapons to
combat an opponents tactics/playing style (short of changing class). I'll
grant you that the maps are pretty decent but, in my opinion, they lack the
invention of the better H3 maps.

> In Halo 3, it seemed very much like whoever had certain weapons would win.
> And whoever had the needle gun thing would lose.

Definitely not. The amount of times I've been needled to death by a more
competent player whilst in posession of the Shotgun/Sword/Hammer is
frightening. In a lot of the ranked matches I've played, the 'good' weapons
end up changing hands over and over again, emphasising the fact that the
weapons *are* well balanced when used well.

>>> So basically, for single player, 99% of all FPS games > Halo 3, for
>>> multiplayer, Something 13 Years Old > Halo 3.
>>
>>Yes. Of course. :p
>
> It's true though. I'll admit, Halo 3 is a far better game than I was
> expecting, but it's still only a 3/5 game for me.

That's fair enough. It would be dull if everybody liked the same things.
Most of your arguments and reasons are wrong, though. :p


Chris.

GT: SomethingWitty
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DBSnappa

External


Since: Oct 15, 2007
Posts: 298



(Msg. 12) Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 5:42 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Best Games Ever [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Chris Stevens wrote:
> "deKay" <andyk.DeleteThis@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote in message
> news:df6co317s0au96e36r9fn3unsjfsjn5j8o@4ax.com...
>>> What was your main complaint about it? I've heard the 'treacle'
>>> complaints,
>>> but I just don't see it myself.
>> Well, yes, it's slow. It's also been done to death already (I've had
>> enough
>> of space marines). The enemy AI showed no sign of any "I" that I could
>> see.
>> It just wasn't fun to play.
>>
>> Admittedly, I haven't played the entire game, just the first two hours, an
>> hour or two in the middle, and the last chapter, but even if they were the
>> worst bits, that's still half of the game I didn't like. And the
>> driving-the-jeep thing bit at the end of the game was horrific.
>
> In the context of the game (climactic finale), I thought the warthog section
> was OK. I still think that you're being a little harsh in your judgement -
> the campaign, really, is meant to be played through in order. You're not
> allowing for any dramatic tension or continuity by playing random missions
> out of order. I also suspect that if you weren't seeing a great deal of 'I'
> from the AI, then you were playing it on Normal. It's a different game on
> Legendary (and frankly too hard for me - I'm only through 2 of the chapters
> at that level of difficulty so far).
>
It's a markedly different game on Heroic. Normal is a boring cakewalk,
Legendary is so hard if makes MC feel like he's wearing a dressing gown
rather than armour.

Anyway, you should know by now it's a futile task arguing with deKay,
even when he's wrong he has too much gaming conceit to admit so Wink
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deKay

External


Since: Feb 18, 2006
Posts: 608



(Msg. 13) Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 5:51 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Best Games Ever [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Thu, 10 Jan
2008 17:10:47 -0000, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
uk.games.video.misc, yawatina tan reek esk "Chris Stevens"
<news DeleteThis @thestevensfamily.plus.com> fornis do marikano es bono tan el:

>> I've spent about 8 hours playing it online, and two hours playing it over
>> a
>> LAN.
>
>8 hours? Are you sure? bungie.net suggests that you've played a total of 12
>matches, which probably equates to less than 2 hours play.

That's probably true. As I said, it's not my game. I borrowed it for the
purposes of playing it on a LAN, and the online play I had was round the house
of the person who owns the disc - presumably under his gamertag.

Actually, thinking about it, I've played a lot more than 12 matches under my
gamertag, online, on my Xbox.

>> TF2 beats it into a cocked hat in terms of map design and weapon balance.
>> In
>> fact, TF2 is the very definition of excellent map design and weapon
>> balance.
>
>It's a bit different, though, isn't it?

Yes. And better for it, IMO.


deKay
--
Lofi Gaming: www.lofi-gaming.org.uk [Gamertag: deKay 01]
Gaming Diary: www.lofi-gaming.org.uk/diary/
My computer runs at 3.5MHz and I'm proud of that
"Zomoniac is wrong"
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deKay

External


Since: Feb 18, 2006
Posts: 608



(Msg. 14) Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 5:52 pm
Post subject: Re: Top Ten Best Games Ever [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Thu, 10 Jan
2008 17:42:15 +0000, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
uk.games.video.misc, yawatina tan reek esk DBSnappa
<davidjboughton.TakeThisOut@REMOVEMEhotmail.com> fornis do marikano es bono tan el:

>Anyway, you should know by now it's a futile task arguing with deKay,
>even when he's wrong he has too much gaming conceit to admit so Wink

I already admitted I was wrong! I said Halo 3 was better than I was
expecting.

It just wasn't very good Smile

deKay
--
Lofi Gaming: www.lofi-gaming.org.uk [Gamertag: deKay 01]
Gaming Diary: www.lofi-gaming.org.uk/diary/
My computer runs at 3.5MHz and I'm proud of that
"Zomoniac is wrong"
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Chris Stevens

External


Since: Jan 26, 2005
Posts: 416



(Msg. 15) Posted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 6:48 pm
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Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Chris Stevens" <news.TakeThisOut@thestevensfamily.plus.com> wrote in message
news:fm5jin$jb3$1@aioe.org...
>> In Halo 3, it seemed very much like whoever had certain weapons would
>> win.
>> And whoever had the needle gun thing would lose.
>
> Definitely not. The amount of times I've been needled to death by a more
> competent player whilst in posession of the Shotgun/Sword/Hammer is
> frightening. In a lot of the ranked matches I've played, the 'good'
> weapons end up changing hands over and over again, emphasising the fact
> that the weapons *are* well balanced when used well.

....and to emphasize that point, a quick check of the detailed stats on
bungie shows that over 70% of my (rather puny 500ish) kills have come with
the 'vanilla' weapons (Assault Rifle and Battle Rifle) and Melee. It's *not*
all about the big weapons...


Chris.

GT: SomethingWitty
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