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Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ?

 
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Orion Ryder

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Since: Dec 30, 2004
Posts: 1233



(Msg. 1) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:16 am
Post subject: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ?
Archived from groups: alt>games>warcraft (more info?)

I was going to keep on with the Arms spec and then rebuild at the end
of the journey when my warrior is pretty much finished runnign around
leveling and soloing and jsut doing 5,10 and 20 man whatevers.

All the talents are set to zero now. I could respec now.

I did not redo anything this morning and the killing was a bit slower
prolly because no arms talents. The lack of mortal strike and improved
rend and the other closely associated ones seemed to really slow down
my killing time. Sunder is still there but with no mortal strike I see
the life bars not going down as fast.

I guess it is cheap enough to just go Arms again and respec later but I
don't want to create probelms in the instances I group up in over the
next few months on the way to level 70. I don't know as much about the
game as all of you people and that is why I ask for some info that
might give me an idea of the course of action I might want to consider.

Soloing and small groups out of the instance seem to require more Arms
specs and if I spec now for defense it looks like I'd prolly be wasting
my time going and soloing and would just be better off doing the
instances when my guildees go there at this point. At the instance
level I am at now no specs in Defense seems survivable but also where I
am at a no Arms specs seem not survivable for the majority of the
activity I take part in.

What I am trying to say is despite no pooints in defense I have been
able to do at least a fair to decent job on the tanking over the last
few weeks. If I can manage this some more for another 15 levels to 70
I'd just assume stick to this. I just don't want to be in the middle of
an instance or raid one month from now and find that I have finally hit
a wall on tanking and am now causing problems for the crew I am with
because I don't have a nice defensive spec setup then.

Then again if I don't hurry and get to 60 and 70 via soloing, grinding,
questing, etc in my spare time I'm not going to be of much use lagging
behind at the mid 50s while my associates are climbing and in need of
some services which I could provide if I am climbing nearly as fast.

Wish I knew more about this game.

Orion

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Enphuego

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Since: Sep 26, 2006
Posts: 201



(Msg. 2) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 7:43 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Dave wrote:
> Dont worry, on the way to 70 there will be Druids and Paladins readily
> available to tank stuff in Instances, and doing a better job then you.
>
> My advice to you would be to respec to Dual Wield Fury, this seems to be
> the Spec with the lowest frustration potential atm.

Worst advice ever...

Keep your Arms spec, you'll get a lot of use out of it. If you want to
level up quick you'll be doing a lot of questing or grinding, where an
Arms spec will help you out. You don't need a defensive spec to
outtank druids or paladins.

DW Fury is a horrible choice, your miss rate will be through the roof.
DW really shines when you have the +hit to make it work. For the
average warrior an Arms spec is the way to go.

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Jack D

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Since: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 55



(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:20 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Dec 6, 4:59 pm, Dave <d....RemoveThis@news.tk> wrote:

> Rage Norm, meet Enphuego.
> Enphuego, meet Rage Norm.
>
> Best of luck to both of you in the Expansion :p

You are aware that rage normalisation for low-geared warriors (which I
assume Orion to be since he is still leveling) will actually increase
their rage generation?
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Orion Ryder

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Since: Dec 30, 2004
Posts: 1233



(Msg. 4) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:57 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Dec 6, 11:45 am, Dave <d....RemoveThis@news.tk> wrote:
> Jack D wrote:
> > On Dec 6, 4:59 pm, Dave <d....RemoveThis@news.tk> wrote:
>
> >> Rage Norm, meet Enphuego.
> >> Enphuego, meet Rage Norm.
>
> >> Best of luck to both of you in the Expansion :p
>
> > You are aware that rage normalisation for low-geared warriors (which I
> > assume Orion to be since he is still leveling) will actually increase
> > their rage generation?You are aware that this is actually not true?

Wait a sec. I am still leveling. And my gear might be considered
low-geared in comparison to many others.

Rockpounder from the giant in uldaman? That has to be low-gear. But it
was a lot better than the Corpsemaker.

Of course since I did not repsec my guy this AM I can't tell if the
rage is building faster. I assumed in the past that DoT such as
Improved Rend and Mortal Strike would also increase my rage at a faster
clip.

I'll know more later I guess.

I'm just lookign forward to the time when I can let Nik watch my
warrior kill the Devilsaur in Un'Goro.

Hey first time this AM I saw the Ironhide Devilsaur. So there are three
of them there?

Orion
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Jack D

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Since: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 55



(Msg. 5) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 9:29 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Dec 6, 5:45 pm, Dave <d... RemoveThis @news.tk> wrote:
> Jack D wrote:
>
> > You are aware that rage normalisation for low-geared warriors (which I
> > assume Orion to be since he is still leveling) will actually increase
> > their rage generation?
>
> You are aware that this is actually not true?

My bad, I should have cited some sources:

http://blue.cardplace.com/newcache/en/83678537.htm

The change to the formula for rage normalization is that the generated
rage has been halved, but you get added rage based on your weapon
speed.

Some calcs show that the following hits generate exactly the same
amount of rage pre and post patch.

Fury:
1.8 weapon speed hit -> hitting 138.6
1.8 weapon speed crit -> critting 277.2

Mortal Strike:
3.5 weapon speed hit -> hitting 261.4
3.5 weapon speed crit -> critting 522.8

If you hit less hard than mentioned here, you will receive *more* rage
post-patch than pre-patch. If you hit harder, it's the other way
around.

So basicly I stick to my statement that a low-geared warrior's rage
generation improves with the normalization.
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Enphuego

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Since: Sep 26, 2006
Posts: 201



(Msg. 6) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 10:21 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Dave wrote:
> Jack D wrote:
> > On Dec 6, 4:59 pm, Dave <d....TakeThisOut@news.tk> wrote:
> >
> >> Rage Norm, meet Enphuego.
> >> Enphuego, meet Rage Norm.
> >>
> >> Best of luck to both of you in the Expansion :p
> >
> > You are aware that rage normalisation for low-geared warriors (which I
> > assume Orion to be since he is still leveling) will actually increase
> > their rage generation?
>
> You are aware that this is actually not true?

I'm cut off from WoW where I'm at right now, so I'll have to wait and
see about rage normalization. From what I've heard, the way it is
supposed to work is that undergeared warriors will get a buff and top
of the line warriors will get a nerf. I heard a rumor that in beta
rage normalization wasn't actually in place, they just took a % off
rage to simulate the effects of rage normalization.

How is it actually working in the live version?
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Eric D. Braden

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Since: Oct 04, 2006
Posts: 910



(Msg. 7) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 10:29 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Dave wrote:
> Enphuego wrote:
> > Dave wrote:
> >> Dont worry, on the way to 70 there will be Druids and Paladins readily
> >> available to tank stuff in Instances, and doing a better job then you.
> >>
> >> My advice to you would be to respec to Dual Wield Fury, this seems to be
> >> the Spec with the lowest frustration potential atm.
> >
> > Worst advice ever...
> >
> > Keep your Arms spec, you'll get a lot of use out of it. If you want to
> > level up quick you'll be doing a lot of questing or grinding, where an
> > Arms spec will help you out. You don't need a defensive spec to
> > outtank druids or paladins.
> >
> > DW Fury is a horrible choice, your miss rate will be through the roof.
> > DW really shines when you have the +hit to make it work. For the
> > average warrior an Arms spec is the way to go.
>
> Do you allow me to introduce you to Rage Norm?
>
> Rage Norm, meet Enphuego.
> Enphuego, meet Rage Norm.
>
> Best of luck to both of you in the Expansion :p

Please keep this in one place. We don't need the same argument in 2
"threads."
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Dave

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Since: Jun 07, 2005
Posts: 267



(Msg. 8) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 10:58 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Orion Ryder wrote:
> I was going to keep on with the Arms spec and then rebuild at the end
> of the journey when my warrior is pretty much finished runnign around
> leveling and soloing and jsut doing 5,10 and 20 man whatevers.
>
> All the talents are set to zero now. I could respec now.
>
> I did not redo anything this morning and the killing was a bit slower
> prolly because no arms talents. The lack of mortal strike and improved
> rend and the other closely associated ones seemed to really slow down
> my killing time. Sunder is still there but with no mortal strike I see
> the life bars not going down as fast.
>
> I guess it is cheap enough to just go Arms again and respec later but I
> don't want to create probelms in the instances I group up in over the
> next few months on the way to level 70. I don't know as much about the
> game as all of you people and that is why I ask for some info that
> might give me an idea of the course of action I might want to consider.

Dont worry, on the way to 70 there will be Druids and Paladins readily
available to tank stuff in Instances, and doing a better job then you.

My advice to you would be to respec to Dual Wield Fury, this seems to be
the Spec with the lowest frustration potential atm.
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Dave

External


Since: Jun 07, 2005
Posts: 267



(Msg. 9) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 11:58 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Enphuego wrote:
> Dave wrote:
>> Dont worry, on the way to 70 there will be Druids and Paladins readily
>> available to tank stuff in Instances, and doing a better job then you.
>>
>> My advice to you would be to respec to Dual Wield Fury, this seems to be
>> the Spec with the lowest frustration potential atm.
>
> Worst advice ever...
>
> Keep your Arms spec, you'll get a lot of use out of it. If you want to
> level up quick you'll be doing a lot of questing or grinding, where an
> Arms spec will help you out. You don't need a defensive spec to
> outtank druids or paladins.
>
> DW Fury is a horrible choice, your miss rate will be through the roof.
> DW really shines when you have the +hit to make it work. For the
> average warrior an Arms spec is the way to go.

Do you allow me to introduce you to Rage Norm?

Rage Norm, meet Enphuego.
Enphuego, meet Rage Norm.

Best of luck to both of you in the Expansion :p
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Dave

External


Since: Jun 07, 2005
Posts: 267



(Msg. 10) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 12:59 pm
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Jack D wrote:
> On Dec 6, 4:59 pm, Dave <d... DeleteThis @news.tk> wrote:
>
>> Rage Norm, meet Enphuego.
>> Enphuego, meet Rage Norm.
>>
>> Best of luck to both of you in the Expansion :p
>
> You are aware that rage normalisation for low-geared warriors (which I
> assume Orion to be since he is still leveling) will actually increase
> their rage generation?

You are aware that this is actually not true?
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PV

External


Since: May 18, 2006
Posts: 4130



(Msg. 11) Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 12:59 pm
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Orion Ryder" <orionryder RemoveThis @hotmail.com> writes:
>Hey first time this AM I saw the Ironhide Devilsaur. So there are three
>of them there?

Three types, yes. I think there's actually more than three running around
at any given time. And they respawn fairly quickly after being killed, too. *
--
* PV something like badgers--something like lizards--and something
like corkscrews.
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JAM

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Since: Dec 06, 2006
Posts: 5



(Msg. 12) Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2006 7:46 am
Post subject: Re: Best Time to Respec Warrior for Defense/Tank ? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Enphuego" <michael.rumsey.DeleteThis@macdill.af.mil> wrote in message
news:1165429276.750016.61370@n67g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>
> Dave wrote:
>> Jack D wrote:
>> > On Dec 6, 4:59 pm, Dave <d....DeleteThis@news.tk> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Rage Norm, meet Enphuego.
>> >> Enphuego, meet Rage Norm.
>> >>
>> >> Best of luck to both of you in the Expansion :p
>> >
>> > You are aware that rage normalisation for low-geared warriors (which I
>> > assume Orion to be since he is still leveling) will actually increase
>> > their rage generation?
>>
>> You are aware that this is actually not true?
>
> I'm cut off from WoW where I'm at right now, so I'll have to wait and
> see about rage normalization. From what I've heard, the way it is
> supposed to work is that undergeared warriors will get a buff and top
> of the line warriors will get a nerf. I heard a rumor that in beta
> rage normalization wasn't actually in place, they just took a % off
> rage to simulate the effects of rage normalization.
>
> How is it actually working in the live version?
>

Personally i see no lessening of rage generation, in a solo situation in any
case. I did the grind from 59 1/2 to 60 last night (you beauty!) after the
server was patched, and if anything found that rage was easier to generate
than beforehand.

LLM has some pretty shoddy gear on, zero epics, scarlet shield and
thrashblade should give you a fair idea of his items (best item he has is
Mugthols helm http://www.thottbot.com/?i=8915, a gift from a guildee).
Possibly well geared warriors will have issues with rage generation, but
someone else will have to report back on that Smile

Regarding warriors being replaced as MT by palladins or (was it) druids(?),
i really can't see it happening. No other class has the skills/abilities to
hold agro as well as what a warrior can. Of course, individual player skills
and abilities may lead to groups being better off having another class tank
(ie the warrior has no idea what he's doing), but IMO there can be no
replacement for a well played warrior leading from the front using his
skills wisely.
Rage generation? That's why there's alchemists and rage potions Wink

Regards
Jay
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