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External
Since: Dec 12, 2007
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:25 am
Post subject: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices
Archived from groups: rec>games>roguelike>angband (more info?)
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I think I read a feature request somewhere to order the monster list by
monster level. If I didn't also read something requesting to change the
color of sleeping monster's names to grey or another color, that would
also help for quick prioritization of targets at a glance.
Another thing that's been bugging me lately are some of the magic items
that have misleading names. Staff and scroll of light actually have
illumination effects. The precedent for naming is already seen in rod
of light vs rod of illumination. Another couple are staff and rod of
enlightenment, both of which actually have magic mapping effects like
scroll of magic mapping. The potion(s), the priest spell, and maybe
some artifact activations are the only true enlightenment effects in the
game. It doesn't really matter, but I always get excited when I see a
staff of enlightenment, before I remember they're really not all that great. |
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External
Since: Oct 18, 2007
Posts: 161
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 4:38 pm
Post subject: Re: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 2007-12-12 07:25:35, Billy Moore <billy DeleteThis @tranquility.net> wrote:
> I think I read a feature request somewhere to order the monster list by
> monster level.
Complete monster list reorganization is scheduled for a complete savegame break
version change on the Trac bugtracker, linked from http://www.rephial.org/ . Be
sure to reset the "days back" to something reasonable. I think 270 days will
catch almost everything right now.
I don't recall exactly how long you have to set it to catch the relevant
features parallel to your requests, but 180 days sounds right about now.
> If I didn't also read something requesting to change the
> color of sleeping monster's names to grey or another color, that would
> also help for quick prioritization of targets at a glance.
Recent versions of V have the monster health bar, which already color-changes
for sleeping monsters.
> Another thing that's been bugging me lately are some of the magic items
> that have misleading names.
This is also scheduled on Trac. |
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External
Since: Dec 12, 2007
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 9:13 pm
Post subject: Re: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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>> If I didn't also read something requesting to change the
>> color of sleeping monster's names to grey or another color, that would
>> also help for quick prioritization of targets at a glance.
>
> Recent versions of V have the monster health bar, which already color-changes
> for sleeping monsters.
I was actually talking about the "currently visible monsters list" you
get when you press [. Uniques are already displayed in purple, normal
monsters are white. It might be nice if sleeping uniques were displayed
in red, and sleeping non-uniques in dark grey. I see the tickets for
some of the monster data file changes, but I didn't see much for the [
monster list.
>> Another thing that's been bugging me lately are some of the magic items
>> that have misleading names.
>
> This is also scheduled on Trac.
Ah, now I see the effect names ticket. Thanks for the response. >> Stay informed about: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices |
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External
Since: Oct 18, 2007
Posts: 161
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 3:41 am
Post subject: Re: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 2007-12-13 04:13:37, Billy Moore <billy DeleteThis @tranquility.net> wrote:
> >> If I didn't also read something requesting to change the
> >> color of sleeping monster's names to grey or another color, that would
> >> also help for quick prioritization of targets at a glance.
> >
> > Recent versions of V have the monster health bar, which already color-changes
> > for sleeping monsters.
>
> I was actually talking about the "currently visible monsters list" you
> get when you press [. Uniques are already displayed in purple, normal
> monsters are white. It might be nice if sleeping uniques were displayed
> in red, and sleeping non-uniques in dark grey. I see the tickets for
> some of the monster data file changes, but I didn't see much for the [
> monster list.
Ah. An argument from consistency could be made for sleeping non-unique blue,
sleeping unique purple, awake unique red. Or maybe there's a better use for the
red/orange/yellow color range -- "known high threat".
Remember, however, that no matter how many monsters of a given type are in
sight/detected, they only use one entry in the monster list. I don't have a
knee-jerk opinion of which color should dominate when only some are affected by
a status -- and text consoles only have 8 or 16 colors usually, so linear RGB
interpolation is not even defined. >> Stay informed about: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices |
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External
Since: Mar 23, 2005
Posts: 96
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 3:52 am
Post subject: Re: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 2007-12-13 04:41:12, Kenneth 'Bessarion' Boyd <zaimoni.TakeThisOut@zaimoni.com> wrote:
> On 2007-12-13 04:13:37, Billy Moore wrote:
>
> > >> If I didn't also read something requesting to change the
> > >> color of sleeping monster's names to grey or another color, that would
> > >> also help for quick prioritization of targets at a glance.
> > >
> > > Recent versions of V have the monster health bar, which already color-changes
> > > for sleeping monsters.
> >
> > I was actually talking about the "currently visible monsters list" you
> > get when you press [. Uniques are already displayed in purple, normal
> > monsters are white. It might be nice if sleeping uniques were displayed
> > in red, and sleeping non-uniques in dark grey. I see the tickets for
> > some of the monster data file changes, but I didn't see much for the [
> > monster list.
>
> Ah. An argument from consistency could be made for sleeping non-unique blue,
> sleeping unique purple, awake unique red. Or maybe there's a better use for the
> red/orange/yellow color range -- "known high threat".
>
> Remember, however, that no matter how many monsters of a given type are in
> sight/detected, they only use one entry in the monster list. I don't have a
> knee-jerk opinion of which color should dominate when only some are affected by
> a status -- and text consoles only have 8 or 16 colors usually, so linear RGB
> interpolation is not even defined.
Since OOD is a much bigger threat in Steamband, I've also been considering
coloring the monsters somehow to indicate they are out of depth.
I will *not* be using the rainbow method. The below is my suggestion, and
requires just 2 new colors. For steam, I also need to add the pet indicator.
White - Awake, in depth
Grey - Awake, OOD
Dark Grey - Asleep
Light blue - Unique
Dark blue - OOD unique
--
-Campbell
- Join the steamband group by sending an email to
steamband-subscribe.TakeThisOut@Yahoogroups.com !
- Visit the Steamband web page, and follow the progress of Steam! (and view my
art!) http://angband.oook.cz/steamband/ >> Stay informed about: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices |
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External
Since: Nov 15, 2007
Posts: 45
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 1:59 pm
Post subject: Re: Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Dec 13, 1:31 pm, Billy Moore <bi....TakeThisOut@tranquility.net> wrote:
> > Remember, however, that no matter how many monsters of a given type are in
> > sight/detected, they only use one entry in the monster list. I don't have a
> > knee-jerk opinion of which color should dominate when only some are affected by
> > a status -- and text consoles only have 8 or 16 colors usually, so linear RGB
> > interpolation is not even defined.
>
> Ah, that's a good point. I suppose at best you could have awake unique,
> sleeping unique, a number of normal monsters (all awake), a number of
> normal monsters (some awake, some sleeping), and a number of normal
> monsters (all sleeping). If you didn't have a special color for "hybrid
> status" groups, I'd rather see the awake color used. Better to think
> your foes are onto you when they're not, than to think your enemies are
> unaware when they're watching you.
>
> I don't particularly have any thoughts or preferences to the colors
> used, but I think the differentiation would convey useful information.
> If, on top of that, the list was sorted by monster level, or by
> uniqueness then by level, you could very quickly get an overview of what
> you faced with just a glance at the monster list.
Just about every main-xxx now is good enough to support overstrikes;
the trouble is that there is no transport from the cave model into the
terminal to get them.
Why not use something like underline, background color, superscripts,
or overstrikes for sleeping, etc? In particular, I would like to see
overstrikes for the new gas clouds in NPP. As it stands, you can see
either the gas cloud or something inside it, but not both.
I don't think I would like to see sleeping monsters in grey, unless
it's the result of a toggle-display command. >> Stay informed about: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices |
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External
Since: Dec 12, 2007
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 3:31 pm
Post subject: Re: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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> Remember, however, that no matter how many monsters of a given type are in
> sight/detected, they only use one entry in the monster list. I don't have a
> knee-jerk opinion of which color should dominate when only some are affected by
> a status -- and text consoles only have 8 or 16 colors usually, so linear RGB
> interpolation is not even defined.
Ah, that's a good point. I suppose at best you could have awake unique,
sleeping unique, a number of normal monsters (all awake), a number of
normal monsters (some awake, some sleeping), and a number of normal
monsters (all sleeping). If you didn't have a special color for "hybrid
status" groups, I'd rather see the awake color used. Better to think
your foes are onto you when they're not, than to think your enemies are
unaware when they're watching you.
I don't particularly have any thoughts or preferences to the colors
used, but I think the differentiation would convey useful information.
If, on top of that, the list was sorted by monster level, or by
uniqueness then by level, you could very quickly get an overview of what
you faced with just a glance at the monster list. >> Stay informed about: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices |
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External
Since: Oct 18, 2007
Posts: 161
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 10:06 pm
Post subject: Re: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 2007-12-13 22:31:42, Billy Moore <billy DeleteThis @tranquility.net> wrote:
> I don't particularly have any thoughts or preferences to the colors
> used, but I think the differentiation would convey useful information.
> If, on top of that, the list was sorted by monster level, or by
> uniqueness then by level, you could very quickly get an overview of what
> you faced with just a glance at the monster list.
A hallucination-proof overview. *Very* useful mid-statgain if you've just been
hit by a Will-o-wisp with ten-ish ice trolls and a trapdoor trap right next to
you; this "feature" probably kept my current (on-hold) Dwarven priestess alive.
I'm waiting for some sign that AS has gotten reliable bandwidth again before
filing a report on this (I don't know if this is a bug or not, but it needs
reviewing). I should also have a "overeffective pseudoid" patch ready once I
know what style is needed. >> Stay informed about: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices |
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External
Since: Nov 15, 2007
Posts: 6
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 12:15 am
Post subject: Re: Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Dec 13, 9:59 pm, pete m <pmac....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Why not use something like underline, background color, superscripts,
> or overstrikes for sleeping, etc? In particular, I would like to see
> overstrikes for the new gas clouds in NPP. As it stands, you can see
> either the gas cloud or something inside it, but not both.
That's a good idea. I guess it depends on what the cloud is made of.
If it is poison, then it would probably be see-through, so what is in
it should be visible to player. What about a cloud of chaos though?
Would that be see-through, or would it give a distorted view of what
is inside it. A could of sparks or smoke may not be completely see-
through. >> Stay informed about: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices |
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External
Since: Dec 22, 2007
Posts: 4
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:49 am
Post subject: Re: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Kenneth 'Bessarion' Boyd wrote:
> On 2007-12-13 22:31:42, Billy Moore <billy RemoveThis @tranquility.net> wrote:
>
>> I don't particularly have any thoughts or preferences to the colors
>> used, but I think the differentiation would convey useful information.
>> If, on top of that, the list was sorted by monster level, or by
>> uniqueness then by level, you could very quickly get an overview of what
>> you faced with just a glance at the monster list.
>
> A hallucination-proof overview. *Very* useful mid-statgain if you've just been
> hit by a Will-o-wisp with ten-ish ice trolls and a trapdoor trap right next to
> you; this "feature" probably kept my current (on-hold) Dwarven priestess alive.
>
> I'm waiting for some sign that AS has gotten reliable bandwidth again before
> filing a report on this (I don't know if this is a bug or not, but it needs
> reviewing). I should also have a "overeffective pseudoid" patch ready once I
> know what style is needed.
I have reliable Internet for a couple weeks. I want to get as much done
then as possible. Patches, etc. now appreciated (in angband-dev,
naturally). >> Stay informed about: [V] Monster list and misleading magic devices |
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