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Civ 4 : Early game strategy

 
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Paul Hyett

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Since: Apr 15, 2005
Posts: 94



(Msg. 1) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:18 am
Post subject: Civ 4 : Early game strategy
Archived from groups: alt>games>civ3 (more info?)

At the start, what do you usually build first?

I normally wait until my first city gets to about size 3 before building
workers or settlers, since doing so stops them growing for the duration
of the build.

Which buildings are your first choices? Technologies?
--
Paul 'Charts Fan' Hyett

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Jeffery S. Jones

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Since: Jun 10, 2004
Posts: 252



(Msg. 2) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:50 am
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On Sat, 24 Nov 2007 09:18:27 GMT, Paul Hyett
<pah.TakeThisOut@nojunkmailplease.co.uk> wrote:

>At the start, what do you usually build first?

If I have fishing and a sea resource, a work boat. If I have a food
bonus to irrigate and the tech to do so, a worker. A good commerce
resource to improve (gold or silver or gems for example), also means a
worker, because that means faster research.

If I can build them, scouts are good for early builds. They are
worth more in the early exploration phase than later. If not, a
warrior is always a good early choice.

>I normally wait until my first city gets to about size 3 before building
>workers or settlers, since doing so stops them growing for the duration
>of the build.

While it is true that a worker stops growth, if you have something
for the worker to improve right away, the long term benefit is
generally good enough to make building the worker first a good idea.
This is most true if you have agriculture and a food bonus which can
be improved by it, or flood plains. The worker delays your growth,
but once built the increased food speeds it up more than enough to
make up for the delay.

>Which buildings are your first choices? Technologies?

Granary and Lighthouse, Library and Marketplace, Courthouse. Most
other buildings are built when needed -- Barracks is only needed in
cities which will build military units.

Tech depends so much on the starting situation, leader, and goals,
that there isn't just one to pick. But techs to make use of
resources, the wheel (generally necessary for everyone), and
mining/bronzeworking for better units, production, chopping and
slavery, are prime goals.

Religious techs are worth shooting for if you can get them. If not,
though, you can be better off skipping the early ones, get alphabet
(before anyone else if possible), then trade for the early techs and
get a later religion. But if you have mysticism to start, you have
such a good shot at getting an early religion you should try for it.
--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>

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user

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Since: Nov 24, 2007
Posts: 7



(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:38 am
Post subject: Re: Civ 4 : Early game strategy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Paul Hyett" <pah.TakeThisOut@nojunkmailplease.co.uk> wrote in message
news:kXqFe5L$c9RHFw6u@blueyonder.co.uk...
> At the start, what do you usually build first?
>
> I normally wait until my first city gets to about size 3 before building
> workers or settlers, since doing so stops them growing for the duration of
> the build.
>
> Which buildings are your first choices? Technologies?
> --
> Paul 'Charts Fan' Hyett

Same here - no settlers or workers til city pop 3.
Set city to max food for growth.
Til then continious warrior.
I explore with these hoping to find and pop goody huts.

Once city is 3 either settler if I see horse or bronze otherwise worker.

If really lucky I pop a hut and get bronze working.
Find copper and plonk 1st settler straight on it.

Warriors kill a few lions wolfs etc and gain exp.
Once copper city is up best warriors are converted to axemen
Any rival city with no archers defending watch out....


General:
I like India / Ghandi as civ / leader.
(love the fast workers and quicker great people)
I try for Stonhenge but make the orcacle a must have.
Slavery and city set for food n' growth helps.

If things are going really well I get writing then research monarchy.
I time getting monarchy to coincide with the oracle wonder.
(switch to building something else if necessary the switch back)
Hey presto - feudalism.

1st great person - Prophet gets Theology.
Then build Hagia Sophia Wonder.
With Serfdom & Hagia Sophia fast workers soon chew the landscape into
shape.....


Techs:
Meditation / Buddism 1st
Wheel, Animal husbandry & Bronze working after.
Then again it depends a bit on what bonus resources you have near.

Priorities: secure a scorce of copper or horse - preferably both.

HTH
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Andre

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Since: Nov 24, 2007
Posts: 2



(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:38 am
Post subject: Re: Civ 4 : Early game strategy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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On Nov 24, 7:03 am, "Öjevind Lång" <bredband.... RemoveThis @ojevind.lang> wrote:
> " ><(((°>" <nos... RemoveThis @butfish.com> skrev i meddelandetnews:kaT1j.31753$dN2.20438@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net...
>
>
>
> > "Paul Hyett" <p... RemoveThis @nojunkmailplease.co.uk> wrote in message
> >news:kXqFe5L$c9RHFw6u@blueyonder.co.uk...
> >> At the start, what do you usually build first?
>
> >> I normally wait until my first city gets to about size 3 before building
> >> workers or settlers, since doing so stops them growing for the duration
> >> of the build.
>
> >> Which buildings are your first choices? Technologies?
>
> No settlers or workers until size three, but if I have Fishing and there is
> seafood in the fat cross, I'l make a work boat after my first warrior. By
> the way, some time ago (playing as Elizabeth, one of my favourites), my
> starting point had a jewelry plot and a seafood plot. What would you folks
> have built first - worker or workboat? I chose worker, but it was a tough
> choice.
> I like to found an early religion; it really gives you a boost. So
> generally, I start with researching Mysticism-Polytheism. If I miss founding
> Judaism, I try for Judaism, which is no detour since I want to discover
> Masonry early. I like to try to build the Pyramids because early PR is
> awesome. I almost always seem to fail to build the Oracle. Before or after
> Masonry (depending on whether I managed to found Hinduism or not), I
> research Agriculture and Animal Husbandry, and then Bronze Working.
> Stonehenge is nice, but if you fail that it is very important to build
> monuments early. Baracks can wait until a little later, and it's usually
> just a waste of time and resources to build them in all your cities. Early
> axemen are necessary. if you don't have either copppr or horses near where
> you start, then you just have to research Iron Working before Shaka or
> Montezuma has you for lunch. Wth BtS, getting a big army early is vital if
> one wants to survive.
> I'm generally a peacenik, but of course, if I find I have a neighbour
> nearby and no one is home, I let my warrior walk straight into it. Once that
> was Julius Caesar, and he lived just six or seven plots away. Of course, it
> would have been suicide to let him live, and besides, past experiences with
> him made the sound of screams and things crashing as I destroyed Rome very
> satisfying.
>
> Öjevind

Why Elizabeth?
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Eddie Grove

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Since: Oct 17, 2007
Posts: 80



(Msg. 5) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:14 am
Post subject: Re: Civ 4 : Early game strategy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Paul Hyett <pah.DeleteThis@nojunkmailplease.co.uk> writes:

> At the start, what do you usually build first?
>
> I normally wait until my first city gets to about size 3 before building
> workers or settlers, since doing so stops them growing for the duration of the
> build.

You and everyone else posting here are crazy. Build a worker first thing
while researching agriculture. Without a worker, you cannot grow quickly.
[Obviously if you have fish or deer for food and no rice/wheat things will be
different.]

Test it out. Next game, play normally until you build a worker. Check the
date on the turn it is produced. Then, restart the game building a worker
first, and then building exactly the same other things you built the first
time before the worker. Continue until the same date, and compare what you
have built and how much food is in the food box and how many resources have
been worked. I bet you will decide worker first produced better results.


Eddie
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Andre

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Since: Nov 24, 2007
Posts: 2



(Msg. 6) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 12:29 pm
Post subject: Re: Civ 4 : Early game strategy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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On Nov 24, 9:19 am, Andre <ANDREJANSSE... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Nov 24, 7:03 am, "Öjevind Lång" <bredband.... DeleteThis @ojevind.lang> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > " ><(((°>" <nos... DeleteThis @butfish.com> skrev i meddelandetnews:kaT1j.31753$dN2.20438@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net...
>
> > > "Paul Hyett" <p... DeleteThis @nojunkmailplease.co.uk> wrote in message
> > >news:kXqFe5L$c9RHFw6u@blueyonder.co.uk...
> > >> At the start, what do you usually build first?
>
> > >> I normally wait until my first city gets to about size 3 before building
> > >> workers or settlers, since doing so stops them growing for the duration
> > >> of the build.
>
> > >> Which buildings are your first choices? Technologies?
>
> > No settlers or workers until size three, but if I have Fishing and there is
> > seafood in the fat cross, I'l make a work boat after my first warrior. By
> > the way, some time ago (playing as Elizabeth, one of my favourites), my
> > starting point had a jewelry plot and a seafood plot. What would you folks
> > have built first - worker or workboat? I chose worker, but it was a tough
> > choice.
> > I like to found an early religion; it really gives you a boost. So
> > generally, I start with researching Mysticism-Polytheism. If I miss founding
> > Judaism, I try for Judaism, which is no detour since I want to discover
> > Masonry early. I like to try to build the Pyramids because early PR is
> > awesome. I almost always seem to fail to build the Oracle. Before or after
> > Masonry (depending on whether I managed to found Hinduism or not), I
> > research Agriculture and Animal Husbandry, and then Bronze Working.
> > Stonehenge is nice, but if you fail that it is very important to build
> > monuments early. Baracks can wait until a little later, and it's usually
> > just a waste of time and resources to build them in all your cities. Early
> > axemen are necessary. if you don't have either copppr or horses near where
> > you start, then you just have to research Iron Working before Shaka or
> > Montezuma has you for lunch. Wth BtS, getting a big army early is vital if
> > one wants to survive.
> > I'm generally a peacenik, but of course, if I find I have a neighbour
> > nearby and no one is home, I let my warrior walk straight into it. Once that
> > was Julius Caesar, and he lived just six or seven plots away. Of course, it
> > would have been suicide to let him live, and besides, past experiences with
> > him made the sound of screams and things crashing as I destroyed Rome very
> > satisfying.
>
> > Öjevind
>
> Why Elizabeth?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

What I'm trying to say is: what traits do you find in Elizabeth that
would give you and advantage? The other poster said Gandhi because of
the fast workers. I'd like to start a poll to see which civs are
people's favourite and why. And is there really an advantage picking
one over the other or do they even out eventually?

Andre
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Öjevind Lång

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Since: May 28, 2006
Posts: 108



(Msg. 7) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 1:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Civ 4 : Early game strategy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

" ><(((°>" <nospam.RemoveThis@butfish.com> skrev i meddelandet
news:kaT1j.31753$dN2.20438@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net...
>
> "Paul Hyett" <pah.RemoveThis@nojunkmailplease.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:kXqFe5L$c9RHFw6u@blueyonder.co.uk...
>> At the start, what do you usually build first?
>>
>> I normally wait until my first city gets to about size 3 before building
>> workers or settlers, since doing so stops them growing for the duration
>> of the build.
>>
>> Which buildings are your first choices? Technologies?

No settlers or workers until size three, but if I have Fishing and there is
seafood in the fat cross, I'l make a work boat after my first warrior. By
the way, some time ago (playing as Elizabeth, one of my favourites), my
starting point had a jewelry plot and a seafood plot. What would you folks
have built first - worker or workboat? I chose worker, but it was a tough
choice.
I like to found an early religion; it really gives you a boost. So
generally, I start with researching Mysticism-Polytheism. If I miss founding
Judaism, I try for Judaism, which is no detour since I want to discover
Masonry early. I like to try to build the Pyramids because early PR is
awesome. I almost always seem to fail to build the Oracle. Before or after
Masonry (depending on whether I managed to found Hinduism or not), I
research Agriculture and Animal Husbandry, and then Bronze Working.
Stonehenge is nice, but if you fail that it is very important to build
monuments early. Baracks can wait until a little later, and it's usually
just a waste of time and resources to build them in all your cities. Early
axemen are necessary. if you don't have either copppr or horses near where
you start, then you just have to research Iron Working before Shaka or
Montezuma has you for lunch. Wth BtS, getting a big army early is vital if
one wants to survive.
I'm generally a peacenik, but of course, if I find I have a neighbour
nearby and no one is home, I let my warrior walk straight into it. Once that
was Julius Caesar, and he lived just six or seven plots away. Of course, it
would have been suicide to let him live, and besides, past experiences with
him made the sound of screams and things crashing as I destroyed Rome very
satisfying.

Öjevind
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David Littlewood

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Since: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 28



(Msg. 8) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 4:42 pm
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In article <17ggk3tn7sdah4pb93151lkn2semg41lam.TakeThisOut@4ax.com>, Jeffery S.
Jones <jeffsj.TakeThisOut@execpc.com> writes
>
>Religious techs are worth shooting for if you can get them. If not,
>though, you can be better off skipping the early ones, get alphabet
>(before anyone else if possible), then trade for the early techs and
>get a later religion. But if you have mysticism to start, you have
>such a good shot at getting an early religion you should try for it.

I always like to found a religion fairly early. I have noticed that the
AI (almost) always seems to go for meditation (Buddhism), so I always go
for polytheism (Hinduism) and usually get there first, at least up to
Noble level.

David
--
David Littlewood
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Öjevind Lång

External


Since: May 28, 2006
Posts: 108



(Msg. 9) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Civ 4 : Early game strategy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Andre" <ANDREJANSSENS1 DeleteThis @yahoo.com> skrev i meddelandet
news:700d4639-3284-4772-a826-6c0a39f1d94a@r31g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...

[snip]

>> No settlers or workers until size three, but if I have Fishing and there
>> is
> seafood in the fat cross, I'l make a work boat after my first warrior. By
> the way, some time ago (playing as Elizabeth, one of my favourites),

>Why Elizabeth?

She is Financial and Philosophical. That means she generates lots of money
and produces Great Persons at twice the normal rate. That is awesome.

Öjevind
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user

External


Since: Nov 24, 2007
Posts: 7



(Msg. 10) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:32 pm
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"Andre" <ANDREJANSSENS1.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:eab2b527-f963-4fbb-bd91-03b346991470@r60g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 24, 9:19 am, Andre <ANDREJANSSE....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Nov 24, 7:03 am, "Öjevind Lång" <bredband.....RemoveThis@ojevind.lang> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > " ><(((°>" <nos....RemoveThis@butfish.com> skrev i
> > meddelandetnews:kaT1j.31753$dN2.20438@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net...
>
> > > "Paul Hyett" <p....RemoveThis@nojunkmailplease.co.uk> wrote in message
> > >news:kXqFe5L$c9RHFw6u@blueyonder.co.uk...
> > >> At the start, what do you usually build first?
>
> > >> I normally wait until my first city gets to about size 3 before
> > >> building
> > >> workers or settlers, since doing so stops them growing for the
> > >> duration
> > >> of the build.
>
> > >> Which buildings are your first choices? Technologies?
>
> > No settlers or workers until size three, but if I have Fishing and there
> > is
> > seafood in the fat cross, I'l make a work boat after my first warrior.
> > By
> > the way, some time ago (playing as Elizabeth, one of my favourites), my
> > starting point had a jewelry plot and a seafood plot. What would you
> > folks
> > have built first - worker or workboat? I chose worker, but it was a
> > tough
> > choice.
> > I like to found an early religion; it really gives you a boost. So
> > generally, I start with researching Mysticism-Polytheism. If I miss
> > founding
> > Judaism, I try for Judaism, which is no detour since I want to discover
> > Masonry early. I like to try to build the Pyramids because early PR is
> > awesome. I almost always seem to fail to build the Oracle. Before or
> > after
> > Masonry (depending on whether I managed to found Hinduism or not), I
> > research Agriculture and Animal Husbandry, and then Bronze Working.
> > Stonehenge is nice, but if you fail that it is very important to build
> > monuments early. Baracks can wait until a little later, and it's usually
> > just a waste of time and resources to build them in all your cities.
> > Early
> > axemen are necessary. if you don't have either copppr or horses near
> > where
> > you start, then you just have to research Iron Working before Shaka or
> > Montezuma has you for lunch. Wth BtS, getting a big army early is vital
> > if
> > one wants to survive.
> > I'm generally a peacenik, but of course, if I find I have a neighbour
> > nearby and no one is home, I let my warrior walk straight into it. Once
> > that
> > was Julius Caesar, and he lived just six or seven plots away. Of course,
> > it
> > would have been suicide to let him live, and besides, past experiences
> > with
> > him made the sound of screams and things crashing as I destroyed Rome
> > very
> > satisfying.
>
> > Öjevind
>
> Why Elizabeth?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

What I'm trying to say is: what traits do you find in Elizabeth that
would give you and advantage? The other poster said Gandhi because of
the fast workers. I'd like to start a poll to see which civs are
people's favourite and why. And is there really an advantage picking
one over the other or do they even out eventually?

Andre

My fav Civ - India, Leader - Ghandi

Compare with Lizze / English......

The philosophical trait of both Ghandi & Elizabeth is really helpful for
getting great people early in the game.
Elizabeth has financial as 2nd trait - ok, but I prefer Spiritual because it
elininates anarchy (lost turns of production) when changing civics or
religions.
Also although Lizzy's special units are supurb (redcoats) they are a late
game unit (for me anyway) whereas fast workers are available from year dot
to end of game.

Just my 2 penny worth.
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Öjevind Lång

External


Since: May 28, 2006
Posts: 108



(Msg. 11) Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:41 pm
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"Andre" <ANDREJANSSENS1 RemoveThis @yahoo.com> skrev i meddelandet
news:eab2b527-f963-4fbb-bd91-03b346991470@r60g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...

[snip]

>What I'm trying to say is: what traits do you find in Elizabeth that
would give you and advantage? The other poster said Gandhi because of
the fast workers. I'd like to start a poll to see which civs are
people's favourite and why. And is there really an advantage picking
one over the other or do they even out eventually?

In addition to Elizabeth's leader traits, which I have mentioned ina nother
psot, her unique unit (Redcoat) and unique building (Stock Exchange) are
also great, at least for my usual gaming style. You can save up Great
Persons and start a golden age when it's time to switch civics so you don't
lose production.

Öjevind
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kaj.stenberg

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Since: Jul 20, 2006
Posts: 10



(Msg. 12) Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:06 am
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Andre <ANDREJANSSENS1.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:


I seem to have a somewhat different starting approach from you guys
(probably because I am a builder and go for a huge empire with tons
of cities): For the first city I go for a location (within 1-2 turns)
to find a good food place. The first unit is then a worker, which I
automate (for some time) to improve land around that city. Meanwhile
my extra unit scouts out the neibourhood some 10 steps all directions
(stop if I see huge deserts or such in the direction, not likely an
enemy city will emerge there early in the game).
When scouting is complete I return the warrior/whatever to
my city and fortify it. I now know the nearby terain and my city is in
good shape due to the worker. The worker is now set to build a road to
where I want the next city, while my first city is building a settler.
After that I try to maximise production of workers/settlers in the fast
growing empire, but this of course depends on the landscape and my opponents.
My first goal is to create 6-10 cities, all connected, tightly
packed (ideally 4 squares in between), all in good food spots. This way
I can assure good internal intelligence, and good production base
capable of performing in-debt defence if needed (I always give peace to
anyone approaching me, but generally I do not offer free passage early in
the game when I do not need it myself). Resources are generally no problem,
my 10 city empire will cover enough ground to find practically anything.


> What I'm trying to say is: what traits do you find in Elizabeth that
> would give you and advantage? The other poster said Gandhi because of
> the fast workers. I'd like to start a poll to see which civs are
> people's favourite and why. And is there really an advantage picking
> one over the other or do they even out eventually?

Intriguing question. In my case experience seems to indicate that my
games tend to run basically the same way regardless of traits or intended
strategy. I beliewe that my own basic personality influences my games
much stronger than any trait I choose. One thing though: in my huge
empire/loads of cities the critical face comes when "empty" territory is
becoming scarce. I then have too few units for effective defence.
Diplomacy is a must here, but also few but powerful units. So I go for
traits with the strong unit being before gunpowder units, and usually a
defencive one. With a lot of cities and science hovering round 80-90 per
cent (at war and special occasions down to 50-60 per cent) I can be
almost certain to be the first discovering my main technological goals:
gunpowder and railway. And particularly the gunpowder I do not give
away. (Huge empire = needs to have mobile army, therefore railway).


--
Kaj
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Bert Byfield

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Since: Jun 30, 2005
Posts: 22



(Msg. 13) Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 7:10 pm
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I usually play Stalin, but I like the Byzantine guy because it's easy
for him to get Buddhism.
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Bert Byfield

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Posts: 22



(Msg. 14) Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 7:19 pm
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> packed (ideally 4 squares in between), all in good food spots.

Do you think 4 or 5 steps between cities (i.e., 3 or 4 blank squares
between them) is more efficient? What about wider spacing? How reliable
do you think the blue hint circles around potential city sites are?
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kaj.stenberg

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Since: Jul 20, 2006
Posts: 10



(Msg. 15) Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 1:11 am
Post subject: Re: Civ 4 : Early game strategy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Bert Byfield <BertByfield.DeleteThis@nospam.not> wrote:
>> packed (ideally 4 squares in between), all in good food spots.

> Do you think 4 or 5 steps between cities (i.e., 3 or 4 blank squares
> between them) is more efficient? What about wider spacing? How reliable
> do you think the blue hint circles around potential city sites are?

I was talking about building a core, early. A city uses two spots
out for its' own use. So early I go for this, there is usually no real
information to react to. Blank spot? Any city has a radius, two each
seems optimal (2 + 2 = 4). I absolutely hate having to produce offensive
units only to get rid of some city, and then there probably is a war
going on too. I hate wars, they cost too much. Better wait until you
can perform a proper genioside.
The blue rings (=recommended spots) too often do not coincide
with what I want/plan to do. But I always check why. Obviosly, it depends.
But up to maybe 25 cities I tend do micromanage cities. And I newer
trust the advisors...

--
Kaj
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