BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1

On Dec 3, 11:43 am, The alMIGHTY N <natle... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

>
> The Wii uses a modified version of the GameCube architecture that
> gives it nearly twice the "power" of the GameCube and allows it to
> play all GameCube games and even use GameCube controllers and memory
> cards. The GameCube was more powerful than the Playstation 2.
>

Corrections

Wii is 1.5x or 50% more powerful than GameCube, not twice as powerful.
Wii uses basicly the same architecture as GCN, but Wii CPU/GPU is
clocked 50% faster Although, Wii does have 3.5x more fast RAM than
GameCube (88 MB vs 24 MB) which is the biggest difference in 'power',
a bigger difference than the actual CPU/GPU.


As for GameCube vs PlayStation2, both systems had various strengths
and weaknesses. GCN was not more powerful than PS2 in *every* aspect,
although GCN was more 'powerful' or better/ more efficient than PS2 in
many ways. PS2 had alot more flexibility with its CPU which had more
floating point performance (6.2 GFLOPs vs 1.9 GFLOPs). Most of
GameCube's power, like with Xbox1, was in the Flipper GPU. PS2's
Graphics Synthesizer can draw more pixels and more polygons than GCN's
Flipper GPU, but only when doing single-textured polygons. When doing
alot of multi-texturing / multi effects per polygon, the GCN's Flipper
really shines. It doesn't lose performance as fast as PS2's GS.
Overall the GCN was a better architecture than PS2, and things are
just more of that with the Wii.

But PS2's advantages over GCN are about the same vs Wii. PS2's CPU is
still more capable than Wii's CPU. But as I said, GCN/Wii
architecture is better, more efficient than that of PS2 architecture,
making GCN and Wii more 'powerful' in real-world / actual games,
overall compared to PS2.
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

On Dec 3, 8:55 pm, "Stephen O'Connell" <no.s... RemoveThis @fk.u.com> wrote:

> The ones that are of the next generation after the X-Box/PS2 obviously.
> Although technically, they are now the current generation, and it's the
> ones that will follow afterwards that are next-gen!

True.

This is how I look at it:

last-gen is:
Dreamcast, PlayStation2, GameCube, Xbox

current-gen is:
Xbox 360, Wii, PlayStation3

or you could subdivide 360/PS3 and Wii into:
current-generation HD and "new generation" SD

next-gen is:
Xbox Next (3rd gen Xbox), Wii HD (Wii 2, Super Wii or whatever),
PlayStation4
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

Nick Soapdish, Jr. wrote:
> On Dec 3, 11:43 am, The alMIGHTY N <natle... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>> On Dec 3, 10:43 am, Luke Curtis <l... RemoveThis @NOSPAM.whofan.plus.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The PS3 and the 360 are proper games consoles, the Wii is a toy.
>>
>> What exactly is a "proper games console" and who decided on the
>> definition?
>>
>> The Wii uses a modified version of the GameCube architecture that
>> gives it nearly twice the "power" of the GameCube and allows it to
>> play all GameCube games and even use GameCube controllers and memory
>> cards. The GameCube was more powerful than the Playstation 2.
>>
>> If what you say is true, the Playstation 2 is not and never was a
>> "proper games console."
>>
>> Try again
>
> Actually, I was under the impression that the Wii is only slightly
> more "powerful" than a Gamecube, not twice as powerful.

It doesn't matter how powerful it is, I certainly wouldn't consider the Wii
a 'next-gen' console. But it is very popular as family entertainment and it
has a big gimmick factor in a lot of its games. So yes, it might sell a
lot, but it's not as relevant to us serious games players as the x-box 360
or PS3.
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

"Stephen O'Connell" <no.spam.TakeThisOut@fk.u.com> wrote in message
news:gh7bb6$s5u$1@news.motzarella.org...
> Nick Soapdish, Jr. wrote:
>> On Dec 3, 11:43 am, The alMIGHTY N <natle....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> On Dec 3, 10:43 am, Luke Curtis <l....TakeThisOut@NOSPAM.whofan.plus.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The PS3 and the 360 are proper games consoles, the Wii is a toy.
>>>
>>> What exactly is a "proper games console" and who decided on the
>>> definition?
>>>
>>> The Wii uses a modified version of the GameCube architecture that
>>> gives it nearly twice the "power" of the GameCube and allows it to
>>> play all GameCube games and even use GameCube controllers and memory
>>> cards. The GameCube was more powerful than the Playstation 2.
>>>
>>> If what you say is true, the Playstation 2 is not and never was a
>>> "proper games console."
>>>
>>> Try again
>>
>> Actually, I was under the impression that the Wii is only slightly
>> more "powerful" than a Gamecube, not twice as powerful.
>
> It doesn't matter how powerful it is, I certainly wouldn't consider the
> Wii a 'next-gen' console. But it is very popular as family entertainment
> and it has a big gimmick factor in a lot of its games. So yes, it might
> sell a lot, but it's not as relevant to us serious games players as the
> x-box 360 or PS3.
>

Stop speaking as you if represent "serious" games players because there are
tons of PC game players who feel that the PS3 and 360 are just as kiddie as
the Wii. Before you get in the habit of just throwing out opinions as fact,
answer this. What is a 'next-gen' console?
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

Mattinglyfan wrote:
> "Stephen O'Connell" <no.spam.DeleteThis@fk.u.com> wrote in message
> news:gh7bb6$s5u$1@news.motzarella.org...
>> Nick Soapdish, Jr. wrote:
>>> On Dec 3, 11:43 am, The alMIGHTY N <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> On Dec 3, 10:43 am, Luke Curtis <l....DeleteThis@NOSPAM.whofan.plus.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> The PS3 and the 360 are proper games consoles, the Wii is a toy.
>>>>
>>>> What exactly is a "proper games console" and who decided on the
>>>> definition?
>>>>
>>>> The Wii uses a modified version of the GameCube architecture that
>>>> gives it nearly twice the "power" of the GameCube and allows it to
>>>> play all GameCube games and even use GameCube controllers and
>>>> memory cards. The GameCube was more powerful than the Playstation
>>>> 2. If what you say is true, the Playstation 2 is not and never was a
>>>> "proper games console."
>>>>
>>>> Try again
>>>
>>> Actually, I was under the impression that the Wii is only slightly
>>> more "powerful" than a Gamecube, not twice as powerful.
>>
>> It doesn't matter how powerful it is, I certainly wouldn't consider
>> the Wii a 'next-gen' console. But it is very popular as family
>> entertainment and it has a big gimmick factor in a lot of its games.
>> So yes, it might sell a lot, but it's not as relevant to us serious
>> games players as the x-box 360 or PS3.
>
> Stop speaking as you if represent "serious" games players because
> there are tons of PC game players who feel that the PS3 and 360 are
> just as kiddie as the Wii. Before you get in the habit of just
> throwing out opinions as fact, answer this. What is a 'next-gen'
> console?

The ones that are of the next generation after the X-Box/PS2 obviously.
Although technically, they are now the current generation, and it's the
ones that will follow afterwards that are next-gen! But this was a
discussion about console sales, and this is a console newsgroup, so
that's all I'm dealing with. And yes, it's my opinion as that's all any
Usenet post is, an opinion. But the people here know what I mean.

As for PC gaming, nobody slagged it off. I used to play quite a lot of PC
games, I still play Age of Kings [conquerors] and that's god knows how many
years old! I even play my sons Nintendo DS, but I do prefer my x-box 360 it
has to be said. The problem I had with PC games was the constant upgrading
of my video card, as certain games didn't play on my old one. So a console
suits me fine.
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

On Wed, 3 Dec 2008 09:43:42 -0800 (PST), The alMIGHTY N
<natlee75 DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Dec 3, 10:43 am, Luke Curtis <l... DeleteThis @NOSPAM.whofan.plus.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 2 Dec 2008 08:16:27 -0800 (PST), ks... DeleteThis @webtv.net wrote:
>> >On Dec 2, 10:03 am, mordacpreven... DeleteThis @hotmail.com wrote:
>> >> On Dec 2, 7:02 am, The alMIGHTY N <natle... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > On Dec 1, 10:27 pm, AirRaid <airraidfigh... DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > > PRESS RELEASE
>> >> > > Xbox 360 Registers Biggest Black Friday in Its History
>> >> > > Xbox 360 consoles and games sell at record levels; outsells
>> >> > > PlayStation 3 by three-to-one ratio.
>>
>> >> > > REDMOND, Wash., Dec 01, 2008 /PRNewswire-FirstCall via COMTEX/ --
>> >> > > Microsoft Corp.'s Xbox 360 video game and entertainment system kicked
>> >> > > off the holidays with record- breaking console sales on one of the
>> >> > > biggest shopping weekends of the year in the U.S. Retailers reported
>> >> > > Xbox 360 console sales over the Black Friday weekend were on pace to
>> >> > > beat previous years, outselling the PlayStation 3 by a three-to-one
>> >> > > ratio and estimating a 25 percent increase from Xbox 360 Black Friday
>> >> > > sales figures from 2007.
>>
>> >> > > Strong game sales rounded out a historic Black Friday for Xbox 360,
>> >> > > with record-paced software sales continuing for key Microsoft titles,
>> >> > > such as "Gears of War 2," "Fable II," and "Lips." Xbox 360 continues
>> >> > > to have the highest game attach rate of any console at 8.1 games per
>> >> > > console.
>>
>> >> > > "We entered into the Black Friday sales period with cautious optimism,
>> >> > > knowing that dollar for dollar, Xbox 360 offers more social
>> >> > > entertainment value than any other console on the market," said Don
>> >> > > Mattrick, senior vice president of the Interactive Entertainment
>> >> > > Business at Microsoft. "Record Black Friday sales in the U.S., coupled
>> >> > > with our existing global install base of 25 million and an online
>> >> > > community of more than 14 million Xbox LIVE members, have laid the
>> >> > > groundwork for continued global sales momentum in 2009."
>>
>> >> > > Xbox 360 sales have also surged worldwide since the September price
>> >> > > drop, outselling the PlayStation 3 week over week across Europe.
>> >> > > Console sales in Europe are up as much as 400 percent, with sales
>> >> > > nearly double year over year and reaching 7 million consoles sold this
>> >> > > generation.
>>
>> >> > > With a mass-market price point starting at $199.99 worldwide
>> >> > > (estimated retail price) for Xbox 360 Arcade, a games lineup of more
>> >> > > broad-appeal social titles than any other platform, and the recently
>> >> > > launched New Xbox Experience, Xbox 360 is leading the industry and
>> >> > > inviting everyone to play.
>>
>> >> > >http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/Xbox-360-Registers-Biggest-Blac...{30D240D0-C7F8-4AFF-956D-5072AC0F997A}
>>
>> >> > Conspicuous in its absence is any mention of the Wii's sales... but
>> >> > this *is* a press release from Microsoft.-
>>
>> >> Serious question:
>>
>> >> Is it really meaningful to include the Wii in a comparison with the
>> >> PS3 and the 360 when neither of those systems competes for the same
>> >> market as the Wii?- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> >> - Show quoted text -
>>
>> >That's what I was thinking. I don't consider the Wii in the same
>> >category as the PS3 and 360.
>>
>> The PS3 and the 360 are proper games consoles, the Wii is a toy.
>
>What exactly is a "proper games console" and who decided on the
>definition?
>
>The Wii uses a modified version of the GameCube architecture that
>gives it nearly twice the "power" of the GameCube and allows it to
>play all GameCube games and even use GameCube controllers and memory
>cards. The GameCube was more powerful than the Playstation 2.
>
>If what you say is true, the Playstation 2 is not and never was a
>"proper games console."

It as nothing whatsoever to do with power but with the design of the
console.

>
>Try again.

The Wii is basically a jazzed up Gamecube with a novelty toy
controller.

I hear so many people say "I have a Wii, it is really great".... but
when you press them they haven't played it for a couple of
weeks/months - it is a toy you roll out to play occasionally when you
have mates round - it is great at that but terrible at playing serious
single player games, that is what most people tell me - that is even
Nintendo seem to imply in the advert I saw tonight, all about party
games, nothing about "serious" games.
-
XBox 360 GT: Broton69

--
ButIstillneedtoknowwhat'sinthere! Thekeytoanysecurity
systemishowit'sdesigned! Thatdependsonwhyitwasdesigned!
Ihavetoknowwhatwhoeverdesigneditwastryingtoprotect!
(Blakes 7, City on the Edge of the World - Vila in typical panic mode)
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

When I
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

ksdj1 DeleteThis @webtv.net wrote:
> When I
>

The same thing happens t
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

Mattinglyfan wrote
>
> I guarantee that my son would rather have a 360 or a PS3
> than a Wii in his room so he would lean that way as well.

Buy him one for Christmas! Or if you are rich, buy him both.
He'll thank you for it!
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

"Stephen O'Connell" <no.spam DeleteThis @fk.u.com> wrote in message
news:ghkhek$7cd$1@news.motzarella.org...
> Mattinglyfan wrote
>>
>> I guarantee that my son would rather have a 360 or a PS3 than a Wii in
>> his room so he would lean that way as well.
>
> Buy him one for Christmas! Or if you are rich, buy him both. He'll thank
> you for it!
>
>

We already have both in the house. I was talking about his own but I am
already buying him a laptop instead.
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

"The alMIGHTY N" <natlee75 DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:362b9d3c-f8ef-487a-89ea-caac32dfa661@f20g2000yqg.googlegroups.com...
On Dec 6, 1:36 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... DeleteThis @comcast.net> wrote:
> "dvus" <d... DeleteThis @dvenator.com.invalid> wrote in message
>
> news:6pvdrjF9qg12U1@mid.individual.net...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Mattinglyfan wrote:
> >> "dvus" <d... DeleteThis @dvenator.com.invalid> wrote in message
> >>news:6pq6quF98ru7U1@mid.individual.net...
> >>> The alMIGHTY N wrote:
> >>>> On Dec 2, 4:53 pm, "dvus" <d... DeleteThis @dvenator.com.invalid> wrote:
> >>>> > GMAN wrote:
> >>>> > > mordacpreven... DeleteThis @hotmail.com wrote:
>
> I too consider myself a "serious" gamer. I have owned every console made
> except Intellivision (Atari Fanboy), Collecovisoion (same reason), Neo Geo
> ($$$), TurboGraphix 16 (smart), and 3DO (smarter).

You owned a Jaguar, a Pippin (well, SOME people considered it a
console...) and a CD-i (ditto)? Ugh.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

No Pippin and I forgot about the CD-i

> I also owned a couple
> like the Vectrex that very few people even owned because I have always
> been
> a "serious" gamer. As for the previous subject, all of those devises do
> deliver an experience of "hard-core, balls-to-the-wall gaming". I have
> never felt as intensely drained on any game as I did the first time my
> then
> 7 year old son whoupped my ass in Wii Sports boxing. I had more intense
> games of Tecmo Bowl and Super Contra back in the day than any version of
> Halo I have ever played.

Super Contra was f'n ridiculous. I didn't bother with that game until
I had the Game Genie codes, haha.

> The original Mario Kart was tons more fun and
> intense for me than Forza, PGR and any other current race games. For me, a
> "serious" gamer is someone who grew up gaming. There are many people in
> here like me who figured out long ago that 1080p and 120fps with 185
> button
> configurations do not automatically make a game better. Some of us had
> more
> fun with Defender and its one shoot button than half of this generation's
> games. The 360 and PS3 are FAR from the only "balls-to-the-wall" capable
> gaming consoles. If you ask 80% of the people that "I" defined as serious
> gamers, their top 5 most intense gaming experiences will almost assuredly
> contain 2, 3, 4 or even 5 games that are not on the PS3 or 360.

Absolutely! While the graphics are obviously great on today's systems,
there have been very few games so far that match the same type of awe-
inspiring, time-eating, life-sucking gaming provided by the systems of
yore.

> If what you
> were saying is that for YOU, these are the only 2 options for that
> experience, there is no reasonable person that would argue with someone's
> personal opinion, My issue was with the fact that you said "serious"
> gamers
> and those of us who have been playing video games in that 30 year range
> may
> not necessarily agree when you try to use the term to frame yourself and
> your opinion for reference. For the record, I don't even necessarily
> consider myself a serious gamer anymore. I spend about $600-$1000 per year
> on my gaming jones. This year was an aberration because I bought a PS3, 4
> Nintendo DS Lites and 2 PSP's so that definitely screwed up my average
> when
> you include games. During school months, I average about 40-50 hours a
> month. During non-school months or Madden Tournament time, I am more in
> the
> 100-150 hour a month range. I now have a shorter attention span for
> non-sports and single-playergames than I did back in the day. I could play
> Baldur's Gate for hours and hours when I was younger. I hit that 30 hour
> wall now with games that I love like Fallout or Oblivion and I stop
> playing
> them. With all that being said, I don't have the time nor do I have the
> energy to devote myself to gaming but that doesn't mean that I don't
> know/remember what its like to be a serious gamer.

I'm no longer a serious gamer by circumstance. While I would love to
be able to play 20 hour marathon sessions and still most certainly
could, life is no longer as free and open as it was when I was in high
school, in college, just out of college, etc.
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

The alMIGHTY N wrote:

[...]
> Yes, but "a hard-core, balls-to-the-wall gaming experience" is not
> definitive of "video games" and a sales comparison says nothing to how
> hardcore the individual systems are. The only thing that matters in
> sales comparisons is the platform.
>
> You're simply trying to push a personal opinion about what makes a
> *good* video game system as a definitive factor in the market when
> it's not.

No, I'm not trying to "push" my opinion, just express it. If others
disagree that's fine.

--
dvus
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1 

In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 dvus <doug DeleteThis @dvenator.com.invalid> wrote:
>> So its the GAMES that makes it not a direct competitor? If that's the
>> case than the DS doesn't compete with the PSP because it is the exact
>> same situation.
>
> To be honest, I can't speak to your analogy because I'm not familiar with
> the DS or the PSP. I consider myself a "serious" gamer, despite the fact
> that I'm not very good at it and AFAIK those devices, and for that matter
> the Wii, don't deliver the experience I crave. Sure, I'd love to have a
> Wii, but I'd also had an electric hockey game. If what you want is a
> hard-core, balls-to-the-wall gaming experience you have two basic choices,
> and we all know which those are.

Whether or not a given device meets your needs or not, doesn't exclude it
from being part of the market. Many people wouldn't even consider Bose
speakers when shopping for a home theater, or Monster Cables when shopping
for A/V cables, yet they are part of their respective markets.

A home video game console is an electronic device that is usually
connected to a television and plays games that are for one or more
people. Games are sold separately from the console, usually on some form
of removable media. Multiplayer is accomplished either through multiple
people playing together in the same room, or increasingly, by connecting
to another console over the internet.

This would mean that the Wii IS part of this generation of game consoles.
You could also argue that it would also mean that things like Leapster's
newer products would almost be considered a video game console, but in
general the market analysts like to split "games" and "edutainment" into
different categories. Note that this excludes portable devices, like the
Nintendo DS, and the Sony PSP, as well as those "TV Games" type gadgets
that come with a few games inside, but offer no expansions or additional
games via cartridge, disc or other media.

--
It's not broken. It's...advanced.
 >> Stay informed about: BLACK FRIDAY - Xbox 360 outsells PS3 3-to-1