Aberrant: First Look questions

> Yup. One of the reasons I'm actually fairly fond of Mutants and
> Masterminds Hero Points; allows a certain amount of that without
> adding every damn power anyone ever inflicted on a character.
>

I always preferred MSH's approach someone could eventually buy the power
"stunt"
if they wanted. M&M has a good approach in general, and can work similarly
(you just spend XP on it, MSH used Karma for both "now" and "later" rather
than having two separate elements)

> >
> >(Makes me wonder about te fixed successes for Strength in Aberrant *L*)
> >
>
> Well, it's just a pain in the ass to use dice for values as high as
> they'd want otherwise.

True. (of course I feel more than 10dice is often too many to roll /ever/)
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 15:21:37 GMT, "Sidhain" <sidhain.TakeThisOut@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>
>
>> Yup. One of the reasons I'm actually fairly fond of Mutants and
>> Masterminds Hero Points; allows a certain amount of that without
>> adding every damn power anyone ever inflicted on a character.
>>
>
>I always preferred MSH's approach someone could eventually buy the power
>"stunt"
>if they wanted. M&M has a good approach in general, and can work similarly
>(you just spend XP on it, MSH used Karma for both "now" and "later" rather
>than having two separate elements)
>

Yes, of course. But in a lot of cases you're talking one-off powers
of the sort you see someone use twice in their carreer and never
again, and I don't think you need to load down character designs with
that sort of thing.

>> >
>> >(Makes me wonder about te fixed successes for Strength in Aberrant *L*)
>> >
>>
>> Well, it's just a pain in the ass to use dice for values as high as
>> they'd want otherwise.
>
>True. (of course I feel more than 10dice is often too many to roll /ever/)

Being an old Hero fan, I don't have problems with large numbers of
dice, but at the upper end in Aberrant to get the same result you'd be
talking about on the order of _60_ or more D10s. That's a bit much
even by my standards.
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 01:05:42 GMT, "Bryan J. Maloney"
<cavaggione.DeleteThis@sbcglobal.not> wrote:

>Wayne Shaw <shaw.DeleteThis@caprica.com> abagooba zoink larblortch
>news:96f1e377e740af26cfbdae51a3cab368@news.nntpserver.com:
>
>> On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 03:29:41 GMT, "Bryan J. Maloney"
>> <cavaggione.DeleteThis@sbcglobal.not> wrote:
>>
>>>Wayne Shaw <shaw.DeleteThis@caprica.com> abagooba zoink larblortch
>>>news:53ac0a0d267f458e2db632130a7deec3@news.nntpserver.com:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 23:06:20 GMT, Sea Wasp <seawasp.DeleteThis@wizvax.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Am I just missing something, or am I correct in noticing that
>>>>> there
>>>>>appears to be a large "gap" in the potential types of Supers you can
>>>>>get from the novas -- specifically, gadgeteers like Iron Man and
>>>>>Weapon-oriented types like Captain America and the original Thor?
>>>>
>>>> Since all Aberrants are essentially what other games would consider
>>>> mutants (or accidental scientific triggered mutants) not a huge
>>>> suprise.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Captain America: Triggered by Super Soldier Serum.
>>
>> Still only works if you buy he was only able to get the benefit
>> because he's a nova. Doesn't work for everyone.
>
>Super Soldier Serum doesn't work for everyone.

Says who? In most versions of the continuity they've gone out of
their way to make sure no one knows how to make it just because to
some degree it _does_ seem to work for everyone. Certainly it's
derivitive the Infinity Formula apparently did.

>
>> And the shield is a problem.
>
>No, it's just a hunk of metal.

Given it's a hunk of metal that has particular properties and has
worked for everyone who's ever used it, I don't think that's a
credible simulation of the character.
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

Sidhain wrote:

>
>>>(Makes me wonder about te fixed successes for Strength in Aberrant *L*)
>>>
>>
>>Well, it's just a pain in the ass to use dice for values as high as
>>they'd want otherwise.
>
>
> True. (of course I feel more than 10dice is often too many to roll /ever/)

Hm, one thing I MISS about Champions: rolling 30d6 at once!

In most games it's silly, but with supers?
Why not? It's so over the top!
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

rgormannospam DeleteThis @telusplanet.net (David Johnston) abagooba zoink larblortch
news:40875de7.51812415@news.telusplanet.net:

> On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 01:05:42 GMT, "Bryan J. Maloney"
> <cavaggione DeleteThis @sbcglobal.not> wrote:
>
>
>>
>>> And the shield is a problem.
>>
>>No, it's just a hunk of metal.
>
> A hunk of metal that defies the laws of physics.
>
>

But nobody else except for Cap surrogates make it do this. So, by the way
it is written, it is obviously not the shield that's doing this stuff. The
shield merely is an extension of Cap's powers and will.
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 23:06:20 GMT, Sea Wasp <seawasp.RemoveThis@wizvax.net> wrote:

>
> Am I just missing something, or am I correct in noticing that there
>appears to be a large "gap" in the potential types of Supers you can
>get from the novas -- specifically, gadgeteers like Iron Man and
>Weapon-oriented types like Captain America and the original Thor?

Aberrant has some serious character creation issues. Take a look at:
http://www.darkshire.net/~jhkim/rpg/aberrant/ab_chargen.html
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 23:06:20 GMT, Sea Wasp <seawasp.DeleteThis@wizvax.net> wrote:

>
> Am I just missing something, or am I correct in noticing that there
>appears to be a large "gap" in the potential types of Supers you can
>get from the novas -- specifically, gadgeteers like Iron Man and
>Weapon-oriented types like Captain America and the original Thor?



The character creation system is horribly unbalanced. It is easier to
spontaneously generate new powers than improve any existing power.

There was a really good deconstruction of Abberant that I found on the
web that showed the inconsistencies in the creation process:

http://www.darkshire.net/~jhkim/rpg/aberrant/ab_chargen.html

It really strikes me like a lot of WW games. Nice to look at with
great background material and a unique world, but no balance at all.
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:45:53 GMT, "Bryan J. Maloney"
<cavaggione DeleteThis @sbcglobal.not> wrote:

>rgormannospam@telusplanet.net (David Johnston) abagooba zoink larblortch
>news:40875de7.51812415@news.telusplanet.net:
>
>> On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 01:05:42 GMT, "Bryan J. Maloney"
>> <cavaggione DeleteThis @sbcglobal.not> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>>> And the shield is a problem.
>>>
>>>No, it's just a hunk of metal.
>>
>> A hunk of metal that defies the laws of physics.
>>
>>
>
>But nobody else except for Cap surrogates make it do this. So, by the way

Uh, no. The manuevers may be Cap, but at least the ability to soak up
kinetic force works for _anyone_.
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 16:51:13 GMT, John Turner
<averyk.TakeThisOut@ev1.REMOVETHISBITTOREPLY.net> wrote:

>It really strikes me like a lot of WW games. Nice to look at with
>great background material and a unique world, but no balance at all.

That's the natural outgrowth of an emphasis on "story" to the
exclusion of "game".
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

"David Johnston" <rgormannospam DeleteThis @telusplanet.net> wrote in message
news:40897b15.107051256@news.telusplanet.net...
> On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 16:51:13 GMT, John Turner
> <averyk DeleteThis @ev1.REMOVETHISBITTOREPLY.net> wrote:
>
> >It really strikes me like a lot of WW games. Nice to look at with
> >great background material and a unique world, but no balance at all.
>
> That's the natural outgrowth of an emphasis on "story" to the
> exclusion of "game".
>

Not really. Sadly, you can build imbalanced characters in any game.
/any/ game none will always be "protected" from that.
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 22:22:01 GMT, "Sidhain" <sidhain DeleteThis @earthlink.net>
wrote:

>
>"David Johnston" <rgormannospam DeleteThis @telusplanet.net> wrote in message
>news:40897b15.107051256@news.telusplanet.net...
>> On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 16:51:13 GMT, John Turner
>> <averyk DeleteThis @ev1.REMOVETHISBITTOREPLY.net> wrote:
>>
>> >It really strikes me like a lot of WW games. Nice to look at with
>> >great background material and a unique world, but no balance at all.
>>
>> That's the natural outgrowth of an emphasis on "story" to the
>> exclusion of "game".
>>
>
>Not really. Sadly, you can build imbalanced characters in any game.

I never said you couldn't. But has it ever occured to you that some
games make it easier than others?
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

> >Not really. Sadly, you can build imbalanced characters in any game.
>
> I never said you couldn't. But has it ever occured to you that some
> games make it easier than others?

Yes, I've found it easier to imbalance point systems for example than semi
random games (Marvel Saga) because you have no limitations or encouragements
on how to spend points to make an archetype or icon rather than a hose.

I'm much of the mind though that, I don't think /the system/ can make a
decision on what's balanced--its just rules, I feel people involved in the
game should be mature enough to make that decision amongst themselves.

I don't like random systems for other reasons, but in general, since any
game can be imbalanced I'd much rather work on the real way to fix that --by
addressing the element with the players.
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions 

On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 22:52:11 GMT, "Sidhain" <sidhain.DeleteThis@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>
>> >Not really. Sadly, you can build imbalanced characters in any game.
>>
>> I never said you couldn't. But has it ever occured to you that some
>> games make it easier than others?
>
>Yes, I've found it easier to imbalance point systems for example than semi
>random games (Marvel Saga) because you have no limitations or encouragements
>on how to spend points to make an archetype or icon rather than a hose.
>
>I'm much of the mind though that, I don't think /the system/ can make a
>decision on what's balanced--its just rules, I feel people involved in the
>game should be mature enough to make that decision amongst themselves.
>
>I don't like random systems for other reasons, but in general, since any
>game can be imbalanced I'd much rather work on the real way to fix that --by
>addressing the element with the players.

And has it occured to you that there are some systems where imbalance
is less obvious and hence can't be addressed as easily?
 >> Stay informed about: Aberrant: First Look questions